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EFV-8 Club Forum / General Ford Discussion / 1938 brakes: woven or molded?

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Posted By Discussion Topic: 1938 brakes: woven or molded?     Tim I 07-18-2010 @ 5:54 PM reply profile send p.m. Member Posts: 73 Joined: Apr 2010 Well, I finally got the rear hubs off my recently-acquired '38 coupe, and the right side is soaked with grease or oil. The fronts are fine, with plenty of meat left on the shoes, but the moving parts seem very dry and in need of lubrication. (Lubriplate?) I plan to stay with the mechanical brakes, and bought a set of floaters from Mac's. I'll need to replace the rear shoes, but should I replace the fronts as well, and convert to the woven linings? (The front shoes on it now seem to have be "normal" molded linings.) I am used to working on cars of the 50's, so I have a lot to learn about my coupe. Any advice will be greatly appreciated! Tim Denver, CO MOXIE 07-18-2010 @ 6:46 PM reply profile send p.m. New Member Posts: 102 Joined: Oct 2009 Woven is the only way to go with mech brakes. They are softer shoes and does not tkae as much pressure to stop. ford38v8 07-18-2010 @ 9:12 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 2762 Joined: Oct 2009 Tim, I disagree with Moxie on this. Molded lining will stop your '38 on a dime with the floaters installed. There is no need whatsoever to use woven shoes in this setup. I'll go out on a limb here and say that your brakes with floaters are as good as any other pre-disc brakes available. The big advantage is that there are no leaky cylinders to contend with, and a second advantage is that nobody, including Concourse judges, will know you have floaters if you cut the threaded adjuster end off the wedges and reinstall them after the floaters are in place. Simply remove them to access the star adjuster. You'll need a cutting wheel to do this, as they are hardened steel. Alan TomO 07-19-2010 @ 7:26 AM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 7253 Joined: Oct 2009 I would replace the front shoes as well. Then you will have the same friction material at all 4 corners. Tom supereal 07-19-2010 @ 7:44 AM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 6819 Joined: Oct 2009 Be sure to locate and repair the source of the oil or grease that entered the backing plate are before you replace the affected brakes. If it is oil, the rear end may be overfilled. If it is grease, the hub seal could be the cause. Inspect the bearing surfaces on the axle housing, particularly the underside, for wear. Ragged housings will soon damage new seals. Pack the hubs only with the yellow "drum brake grease". Common lube, particularly synthetics, will result in the problem your describe, as well as promote erosion of the axle housings. The only place to lubricate brakes is the raised places where the shoes ride on the backing plate. We use very small dabs of a sticky grease, such as Mystik JT-6, rather than a white grease, such as Lubriplate. Any grease on the linings will cause serious problems. Tim I 07-21-2010 @ 8:47 AM reply profile send p.m. Member Posts: 73 Joined: Apr 2010 Thank you, to all who replied. I will go ahead and replace the front brakes also, so that the friction meaterial is the same front and back. I imagine it's more critical with mechanical brakes. I was going to just order some shoes but no one seems to have cores, so I guess I get my shoes re-lined. I notice Mac's has a tool for re-lining. Is that a fairly easy job, or should I have it done professionally? On lubrication, it looks like there are a couple of pivot points in the actuating arms on the backing plates that might benefit from a little lubrication. Is that not a good idea? Also, is it necessary to lube the cables where they go through the housings? I can't tell if the oily mess at the one rear drum is grease or differential oil mixed with brake dust. There seems to be a lot of it though. Last night, I was going to remove the plug to check the level in the differential, but I don't have any tool to get it out. The recess is square, not hex, and is too big for a 1/2" ratchet drive, and too small for a 3/8." What should I use to get that out? All advice appreciated! Tim supereal 07-21-2010 @ 9:04 AM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 6819 Joined: Oct 2009 Unless the plug has been changed, a 3/8 should fit. We use a long extension without a socket on the end to make the job easier. The plug often contains encrusted dirt and other road crud, so you many have to clean out the recess to allow the wrench to fit. Drain any excess lube. The level should be kept below the filler hole. ford38v8 07-21-2010 @ 1:41 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 2762 Joined: Oct 2009 Tim, in answer to your last questions, any brake system will benefit from replacement of worn parts, and your cables have likely been rusted at times over the years, so if you cannot obtain NOS cables, then at least pull your cables, clean them and the sheaths with solvent, and re-lube them properly. I used Fifth Wheel Grease, from a truck supply. This is water proof, won't run out, and will permanently lube your cables. For the shoes, do not take your shoes to just any old brake shop, as what you will get will be thin shoes with metal embedded, as mandated by new Government Standards for modern cars, not what you need for your old car. You need the old style thick asbestos shoes, which are still available from industrial brake sources. Google Brake Specialties, and you'll find a source who can furnish the shoe material, or will reline your shoes. What you won't be able to find is someone to properly arc the shoes to your drums, due to the asbestos dust produced by that process. Not to worry, though, as they will seat themselves over a short time. The rear backing plate has a zerk fitting that will fill your drum with grease if you are overzealous when greasing. The internal side of the backing plate has a cup around the axle to catch grease spinoff, likely overflowing grease on your car. Alan

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