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Posted By Discussion Topic: Cooling Problems Too -- page: 1 2 3 4     carson nv 07-19-2013 @ 7:14 PM reply profile send p.m. Member Posts: 19 Joined: Jul 2013 Hey all! Im new to the forum but not the V8 Club. Ive really learned a lot tonight reading. I recently finished assembling a '40 Deluxe Wagon. Its a long story but when I brought it home the car was in many pieces but the mechanical and electrical were done. The car is now complete but I cant get the dang thing to cool down! It runs just below the hot mark and any kind of hill will push it over the edge. Idling in the garage will eventually boil it too. The dwell and timing are set perfect. The brakes don't drag, hot or cold. The muffler pings like it should when you bang on it. Im now using Skip's water pumps. I took the radiator to an expert radiator shop and had it flow tested and checked. The flow couldn't be any better. No corrosion at all in the radiator. It runs like a champ and has about 400 miles now thanks to the Grand Tour from Tahoe Last month. (That was the only day I could attend the meet). Overheated twice that day. Im at my wits end with this thing! Its undriveable when its hot out! The engine was built by Red Hamilton's shop just before he moved from Sacramento. I never would think that the problem could be internal. I have no idea what the bore is. Its suppose to be a '39 truck engine. 9T on the heads. The other thing Ive noticed is that it burned all the paint off of the intake manifold below the carburetor where the exhaust crosses over. Could this be a clue?? Anyway...any suggestions would be welcome. It saddens me to think I'm going to have to take it back apart. This message was edited by carson nv on 7-19-13 @ 7:15 PM ford38v8 07-20-2013 @ 12:10 AM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 2758 Joined: Oct 2009 Welcome to the Forum, good looking set of wheels you have there! We'll try to help you get it right without tearing it down. First, let's determine the exact problem you have... You didn't say what the symptoms were, "overheating" can mean different things to different people. A gauge reading hot means nothing, really. Is the radiator blowing off while you're driving? If it only blows when you stop, that's not unusual. Do you have to add gallons of water, of just top it off? You should have a small air space at the top of the radiator, just to the bottom of the fill tube. Do you run thermostats? Take them out. Skips pumps need the extra flow, and you'll only experience a few minutes longer to warm up in the morning. Do you have a 4 lb pressure cap on your radiator? This will give you a few more degrees F before it boils over. If you have the overflow tube separate from the fill cap, you'll also need Skips 3 1/2 lb pressure valve on the bottom of the overflow tube. Is your fan operating properly, and your pumps as well? A loose belt will allow slippage and heat. Do you have a lower radiator splash pan installed? This is important to direct flow through the radiator and not under it. Is your fan position close to the radiator? Whatever you can do to bring them closer together will be a big help. Are youy using antifreeze? I know it gets cold in Carson, but this is summer, and nothing cools better than water. Antifreeze can produce foam, not your friend.Don't use hard water, as it will leave deposits in the system. A rust inhibitor is needed also. I'm not sure how to determine if you have a blockage in the exhaust, but I've not heard that a rap on the muffler is sufficient to rule it out. As a last item to check, but not least, have your radiator shop run a test at the radiator cap for exhaust gasses. Bad news, sorry. Alan This message was edited by ford38v8 on 7-20-13 @ 12:19 AM carson nv 07-20-2013 @ 7:35 AM reply profile send p.m. Member Posts: 19 Joined: Jul 2013 Hi Alan, thanks for the reply. To answer your questions, when I say overheating I mean it. Its not a gauge problem. It does push coolant out when driving if I work it hard like going up hill. Also does it around town when going slow. As long as I stay on level ground at 35 mph plus, it will stay just below the H mark. After I experienced loosing a lot of coolant, I installed an overflow tank to catch it. That works really well but the system isn't pressurized at all. I never have to add coolant. The thermostats are out and the amount of flow is amazing really. The fan is very close to the radiator and the belt is snug. It has the pan under the radiator too. I was using antifreeze at a 50/50 mix along with some "purple ice". I will switch to good water and rust inhibitor when I put the radiator back in. One thing I hadn't mentioned is that the car sat for 17 years prior to coming to me. Is it possible that the engine has severe corrosion inside? When I stick my finger in the outlet at the top of the head, I get some brown grit out. I definitely want to flush the block thoroughly but Im not sure what to use. I read that vinegar is good for that. Seems like it would take a lot of it to fill each side of the block, but ok. Maybe you have a better suggestion? I havnt ruled out the muffler. It blew a whole bunch of cr*p out when I first got it running a few months ago. I have a "Smithys" muffler on the shelf I can try for comparison. Matt supereal 07-20-2013 @ 8:03 AM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 6819 Joined: Oct 2009 The brown grit you found is likely core sand left over from the block casting. If you found it with your finger, it is probable a pocket of the stuff has come loose and reached your radiator. We poke around in the water jacket when we rebuild an engine, and usually find lots of it. I suspect the increase circulation of the new water pumps has caused the sand to be loosened, ending up in the radiator. Flow testing isn't always an accurate indicator of how many tubes are plugged. I'd pull off the water pumps and back flush the block with water thru the outlets on the heads until the water runs clear. Vinegar or commercial flush compounds really don 't do much, in my experience. If you find more sand, the radiator will need to be cleaned, as well. ford38v8 07-20-2013 @ 9:33 AM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 2758 Joined: Oct 2009 Matt, Supereal has great suggestions, the years since the rebuild and the loosened core sand do indicate a backflush is in order. As part of the process though, I'd also do the vineger thing. Vinegar is cheap compared to the comercial cleaners which are now useless anyway due to the EPA requirements. You can do the backflush with a garden hose: Remember, there are two separate cooling systems in a flathead, each needs its own backflush. Alan carson nv 07-20-2013 @ 9:50 AM reply profile send p.m. Member Posts: 19 Joined: Jul 2013 Thanks guys. Definitely gonna do the backflush. supereal, you say to do it with the water pumps off which is fine but is it ok to block off the hose inlet on the pumps for a soaking with vinegar? Then remove the pumps for flushing?? carcrazy 07-20-2013 @ 12:45 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 1653 Joined: Oct 2009 Hi, Have you tried using an air deflector at the top of the grille? It fits between the grille and the radiator to deflect the air flow through the radiator. It doesn't have to be an expensive chrome plated or stainless steel item but can be simply made of sheet metal or thick cardboard. It can be held in place with cable ties or twisties so as to be easily removable when you want to show the car. Old Henry 07-20-2013 @ 1:26 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 738 Joined: Apr 2010 Here are detailed step by step instructions of how I backflush the 59A-B engine both sides at the same time you might want to look at: http://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=83557 I've heard good things about filling the cooling system with vinegar (yes - 5 gallons of it) and driving it a week or two then backflushing and filling with water and baking soda to neutralize the acid, flush again and fill with coolant. Old Henry (The older I get, the better old looks.) Pauls39 07-20-2013 @ 2:10 PM reply profile send p.m. Member Posts: 81 Joined: Oct 2009 Use a vacuum gage to determine if the exhaust is plugged. The burned paint may be a clue. Also re- torque the heads to be sure the gaskets are sealing. If the overheating continues, remove the upper radiator hoses, and the fan belt. Put enough clear water in the system to cover the water outlets in the heads. Run the engine and look for exhaust gas bubbles in the water outlets. You may have a blown head gasket, warped head, or a crack in the block or head. supereal 07-20-2013 @ 3:09 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 6819 Joined: Oct 2009 Sure. If you want to soak the block, do so with the pumps in place. Lime builds up in the block over the years, and a coating less than paint reduces cooling efficiency significantly. As your problem appeared after the installation of the new pumps, i doubt the lime had much to do with it, but soak it at least overnight. The interior of the block is very rough, and any foreign material there can seriously impact cooling. Fords have always been subject to heating, as the exhaust is routed down thru the water jacket. That is why everything must be in good condition for reliable operation. The burned paint over the intake manifold heat risers is normal. This message was edited by supereal on 7-20-13 @ 3:13 PM

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