Early Ford V-8 Club Forum

EFV-8 Club Forum / General Ford Discussion / New Heating Puzzle for Us

Reply to Discussion | New Discussion << previous || next >>

Posted By Discussion Topic: New Heating Puzzle for Us -- page: 1 2 3     len47merc 09-08-2016 @ 12:20 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 1165 Joined: Oct 2013 Ok - on the ride back from Gettysburg in 95+ degree heat with a 4# cap, 2-year/5,000 miles old 67/33 distilled/EG mix, clean radiator/block & new water pumps (see pic), running 60 mph/2,500 rpm the '47 59AB ran ~195 degrees. Today I decided to drain, flush and re-fill the cooling system. To flush it I filled it with 5 gallons of distilled water, got out the original no-pressure cap (see second & third pics) and drove the car non-stop 50 miles at 60 mph/2,500 rpm in 95 degree temps today. So here's the quiz - why is the car, in the same ambient conditions and operating parameters, now running 174 degrees (20+ degrees cooler) with pure distilled and a zero pressure cap versus 195 with a 67/33 mix and a 4# cap? Is pure distilled that much better than EG at heat-transfer? Is the no-pressure original cap at play? I'm baffled. After cool-down I drained the system and refilled with a 75+/25- distilled/EG mix. Have yet to give that a test yet. Still puzzled by the above results. EDIT - all temps were confirmed with a thermocouple & Fluke meter. The dash gauge also reflected the previously established and known ~positions for the 174 & 195 degree figures. Steve This message was edited by len47merc on 9-8-16 @ 12:26 PM len47merc 09-08-2016 @ 12:21 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 1165 Joined: Oct 2013 Here's the top of the cap that came with the car and is thought to be the original. Steve len47merc 09-08-2016 @ 12:22 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 1165 Joined: Oct 2013 And a pic of the bottom of the cap. Steve ford38v8 09-08-2016 @ 3:34 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 2759 Joined: Oct 2009 Steve, We all know that nothing cools better than plain old water, but that's not your answer. What happened to you was you had an air lock in the system. Happens a lot in the hot water heaters. Air bubble diverts flow. Gotta purge. Lift your leg and burp. Say Ahh. Fill while engine running to avoid the bubble. Take this info to the bank. Alan len47merc 09-08-2016 @ 4:32 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 1165 Joined: Oct 2013 Thanks Alan - never thought of that obviously, but have to dig a little deeper to understand this. Air bubble in the heater? What's the diff between that and simply shutting off the heater control valve on the passenger side head for the summer? And the IR thermometer showed equitable temps on both sides. Not too concerned about having run the engine that long at that temp - just cannot get my head around this on these flatheads - seems I'd have seen much higher temps/boiled over, neither of which happened. Please put a little more meat on the bone for my thick head here - Steve pauls39coupe 09-08-2016 @ 7:10 PM reply profile send p.m. Member Posts: 205 Joined: Jul 2014 Oh yeah, pure water will cool a lot better. I'm not sure 20 degrees better but you will find out on your next test. Products like Water Wetter seem to work well at reducing the temperature, by reducing the surface tension of the water. The four pound thermostats will raise the boiling point about 4 degrees per pound or 16 degrees total. This will keep the water from turning to steam but won't actually lower the water temperature. The increased pressure may help keep steam pockets from developing, particularly in the far corners of the heads, and this could help with cooling. The mixture of anti-freeze will also raise the boiling point. Let us know how your next test comes out. ford38v8 09-08-2016 @ 7:35 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 2759 Joined: Oct 2009 Steve, you're really making me work here. And Paul makes some powerful points also. An air lock can happen elsewhere besides within the heater circuit, but then, your dual gauges tend to make that a thin argument. There should be an easy answer to a 20ºF difference. If all conditions are known, a couple degrees here, maybe a few degrees there, but are all the different conditions and consequences really known? Exactly what are the instructions with your anti-freeze? And why is antifreeze even needed in 95º weather? If the combination of an incorrect mix ratio and lack of a pressure cap, plus maybe an air bubble? And, the route driven? A difference in altitude or grade? Perfect storm? You're baffled, and I'm stumped. Alan len47merc 09-08-2016 @ 7:50 PM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 1165 Joined: Oct 2013 The EG is only for the lubrication and anti-corrosion contribution. I'll also run this for the next two years or so before the next flush. I've chalked this up to your suggestion of trapped air somewhere in the system Alan and plan on taking your advice in the morning and givin' her a good old leg-lifting, multiple pat-on-the-back burpin' with the fresh fluid and call it a day. My local shop wants me to run 50-50 but I just don't see the need. And they don't recommend straight distilled with only a lubricant/anti-corrosion additive. 20% EG should get me to below 20 degrees or so in freeze protection which, though possible and happens a couple of times each winter, is rare here in central NC. Boiling point raised to 216 plus conservatively 2.5 degrees per lb for a 4 lb cap gets it to 226 degrees on the high side. Plus the car is garaged and never sees anything below freezing anyway and also never came close to the higher temp on the recent drive. Burp it in the morn and take it out for a cruise mid-day in the heat of the day. Will report back. Thanks for the effort Alan - sorry to put your nose to the grindstone today...but, ya know, it keeps you fresh! Steve This message was edited by len47merc on 9-8-16 @ 7:51 PM len47merc 09-09-2016 @ 4:17 AM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 1165 Joined: Oct 2013 And Alan, note as always, I did, take it to the bank. Should've thought about that myself - know I impatiently/mistakenly/absent-mindedly/senior moment forgetfulness didn't burp it with the last change and given I was running a 4# cap and have only driven it around town since, any air was likely never purged. Yesterday when I installed 5 gallons of distilled and the original no-pressure cap for the drive/flush any air was likely purged and the cooler temps were realized. Taking it to the bank - I strongly suspect I had air trapped somewhere on both sides of the block before this change. As always thanks much for sharing your experience and advice. Out at 2 or so today for a cruise at speed with the burped 75/25 mix. We'll see how that compares with the pure distilled. And btw - I do not have dual gauges, only the stock temp gauge that I previously validated the various cold-to-hot readings with a TC/Fluke. I test the coolant temp in the top of the radiator with the TC/Fluke, and side-to-side head temp comparisons with the IR thermometer. It'd be blasphemy to have anything other in the car... Cheers - Steve TomO 09-09-2016 @ 7:06 AM reply profile send p.m. Senior Posts: 7252 Joined: Oct 2009 I don't have an answer for the 20 degree change, but I would question if the conditions are exactly the same, (same temp, same wind, same sun,etc). The cap that you call the original looks like a pressure cap to me, are you sure that it doesn't provide pressure? Are you sure that your aftermarket radiator cap is providing pressure? Tom

<< previous || next >>

PAGE: 1 2 3

NOTE: YOU MUST BE A REGISTERED USER AND BE LOGGED IN TO POST (and reply to) messages in this forum. If you are a first time user, please click the CREATE A NEW ACCOUNT in the masthead above to register and Log In. After that, all you do is LOG IN to enjoy using this site.

DISCLAIMER: The V-8 Club does no independent testing of any of the opinions, thoughts or suggestions presented in the website on the Forum, in the Tech Tips section, or any section. A reader should consider the website to be a forum wherein differing solutions to a particular set of circumstances may be discussed. Ultimately, the selection of an item for an individual's vehicle must be based upon the independent study of the vehicle owner in consultation with people in the hobby and restoration experts.

EFV-8 Club Forum Home | Back to Home Page | Contact the Webmaster

Copyright © 2009 - EFV-8.org
Powered by < CF FORUM > v.2.1