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EFV-8 Club Forum / General Ford Discussion / hydraulic brake adjustment 40-48

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Discussion Topic: hydraulic brake adjustment 40-48 -- page: 1 2 3

usapro

01-10-2012 @ 4:44 PM

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Having replaced everything - there no leaks- no air in lines, etc. brake shoe adjustment is good. However, I
still do not have what I would called great peddle- If I slightly tap the peddle first the brakes are great.I have done brakes before without this challange. I really do not know how I found this mess.
Is there a critical point with the bypass valve portion of the master cylinder and the peddle adjustment. Thanks in advance for your help.
Digit

37RAGTOPMAN

01-10-2012 @ 5:08 PM

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Do you have 1 inch of free play in the brake peddle ?
what kind of brake fluid are you using,?
when you hit the brakes for the first time,is the peddle high ? and is lower the second time,?
let us know,.
37RAGTOPMAN

supereal

01-10-2012 @ 7:08 PM

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See my answer to a brake problem below.

This message was edited by supereal on 1-10-12 @ 7:10 PM

usapro

01-11-2012 @ 6:55 AM

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Superreal I could not find you answer below. Please add it to your message or tell me how to dig it out.
Pedal Free play
The pedal has about 3/4" play. If you push down hard in goes almost to the floor. A slight tap prior to pushing the pedal you have super brakes - in that case the positive brake activation is two inches from the top position of the pedal.
Thank you I appreciate your efforts on my behalf.
Digit

supereal

01-11-2012 @ 7:23 AM

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There are several reasons why pumping the brakes is necessary. First, the manual adjustment of the brake shoes at each wheel must be correct. If too loose, the stroke of the master cylinder may not be sufficient. The system may contain air, in spite of extensive bleeding. That is particularly true if DOT 5 (silicone) fluid is being used. It "entrains" air, making it nearly impossible to get all air out. The residual valve in the master cylinder may be leaking. This is an internal valve that retains a slight pressure in the system as the pedal is released to prevent the need to pump up the system, particularly after idle periods. Replacement of the master is the cure. The amount of pedal free play should be about an inch. but lack of free play usually causes dragging brakes when the fluid can't return to the master cylinder reservoir. That doesn't seem to be your problem. Bleeding the brake system in old Fords can be tricky, as the wheel cylinders are above the master cylinder. The old "pump and hold" method commonly requires lots of fluid to be bled to get a reasonable "pedal". At our shop, we use a bladder-type bleeding machine to get the job done quickly. Any small amount of air in the system will cause a soft pedal. If you get a hard pedal, but pumping is required after the car sits awhile, I'd suspect the master cylinder.

TomO

01-11-2012 @ 7:30 AM

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It sounds like you have some air in the system.

Try bleeding the brakes without pumping the pedal. Have your helper press on the brake pedal and open the bleeder at least 1/2 turn, close it when the fluid stops coming out, release the pedal and check the fluid level.

Tom

37RAGTOPMAN

01-11-2012 @ 1:39 PM

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usapro
slide the master cylinder rubber boot back and see if you see any signs of any brake fluid,on the inside of the boot or on the master cylinder
let us know, 37RAGTOPMAN

usapro

01-11-2012 @ 4:16 PM

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This has a new master cylinder.
We bled brakes by keeping hose from fitting buried at the bottom jar of fluid to eliminate air in system.
There is no leak from master cylinder.
We are using regular DOT 3 fluid.
Brakes are not dragging. We adjusted for slight brake shoe touch on drums
I agree it feels like air, but just a slight tap on the pedal is much better than when you have air in the system and hit the brakes.

Thanks for all your help -Seems I am left with one choice - go back to square one replace the new master cylinder.
Digit

supereal

01-11-2012 @ 7:01 PM

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The residual valve is an interal device in the master cylinder, and any leak is not visible on the exterior, or in the boot. It could be hung up on rust or other contamiinant. Just because a part is new, doesn't mean it is good. Today, those of us in the trade send back new defective parts very often. Much is due to the fact that they are foreign made. The fact that it is "new" is a strong indicator that it may be the cause of your problem, particularly if all other parts of the system have been found to be OK. If you are sure that something is good, it probably isn't. I learned that years ago. Even parts marked "USA" are more often than not, from offshore.

TomO

01-12-2012 @ 10:46 AM

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Before removing the master cylinder, try bleeding one more time.

Tom

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