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Discussion Topic:
Wiring
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supereal |
07-11-2013 @ 11:08 AM
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Senior
Posts: 6819
Joined: Oct 2009
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The three posts go to 1. battery, 2. horn button or ring, 3. horn(s). To identify those posts, place an ohmeter across the first two. If you get a reading, that is the relay coil. The horm post will show no connection to the other two, as it goes to the output of the relay points, and isn't powered until the relay is pulled. Most of the relays I've seen use the first post for battery, second for the button or ring, and the third to the horns. Many repro relays are not marked. If the horns don't blow at high output, reverse the battery and button connections at the relay.
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Fred Hanks |
07-11-2013 @ 7:21 AM
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Member
Posts: 30
Joined: Aug 2010
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Jus got horn relay 4 my '49...there is no marks as to what wire goes to where on the 3 posts ? I will pull power from starter sol. wire #1 ,wire #2 from bottom of steering box & #3 to horns...
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TomO |
07-10-2013 @ 8:16 AM
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Amen.
Tom
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supereal |
07-08-2013 @ 2:45 PM
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It isn't only cars. We bought a new GE kitchen range a couple of years ago, and my wife still hates it. In order to change the oven temperature, you must turn the oven off and start over, reprogramming it to the desired temperature. She (and I) don't understand why a simple knob wouldn't be much better! Just because exotic microprocessing circuitry is available, you don't HAVE to use it! I was a broadcast engineer for more than three decades, and saw technology "progress" from tubes to transistors, and on to integrated circuits (black boxes), making diagnosis and repair difficult to impossible. That was nature's signal for me to go home and play with my old cars!
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TomO |
07-08-2013 @ 8:28 AM
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I agree completely. I had to get rid of my wife's 1998 Taurus, and shopped all of the new crossovers. I ended up getting a Chevy, because it had the simplest controls for the radio and other driver controls. She has had the car for about 2 months and still gets confused with the multifunction controls. The engineers are asked if you can do something and because of newer technology they can, so it is done. Then all of the unintended consequences show up when the vehicle is delivered to the customer. They use microprocessors for items that could be handled by a more simple approach, but is cheaper to do with the electronic already in place. You cannot buy a simple vehicle that can transport people comfortably today. The only simple ones are the econoboxes that you have to be a contortionist to get in and out of.
Tom
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supereal |
07-07-2013 @ 1:17 PM
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Tom, I have come to believe that the design engineers have turned their attention to creating "improvements" that make operation so complicated that ordinary things require undivided attention that threatens driving safety. When we took delivery of a new Lexus last year, even the dealer couldn't explain how to do the radio presets with the new system! A local dealer sent us a newer Cadillac that had an obvious problem with a dead battery. We found the cause was a failing R/C circuit that controlled the dimming of the interior lights. It was located inside the rear light, and was failing to turn completely off, but would drain the battery overnight. It didn't show on the wiring chart. Dealing with microvolts and microamps is a whole new ballgame, and doesn't bode well for car longevity.
This message was edited by supereal on 7-7-13 @ 1:19 PM
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TomO |
07-07-2013 @ 8:38 AM
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Back in the early 1980's, IBM adopted the serial bus for some of their products. It is a much less expensive way to handle communications between micro processors and it is less troublesome than multi connection cables. It was difficult to develop servicing procedures at first, but as they became more prevalent, it became easier. Today it is not a problem because the replaceable units contain so much circuitry and error detection methods, that the tech can easily find the failing unit and replace it. The problem of proprietary information on the bus and how to handle it is not an easy one to solve. If you allow a program in a test device to decode the bus information, you give your competitors a good look at how you designed the microprocessor. The current solution is a proprietary reader program that doe not disclose the actual buss content, but allows the user to see the result. I still don't see the need t have a micro-processor move the headrest when if they made it adjustable for the user, you would not need the motorized adjustment.
Tom
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supereal |
07-06-2013 @ 3:57 PM
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Tom, nothing much surprises me regarding newer cars. The trend toward muiltiplexing to save wiring is a nightmare. Various components are linked by a common "bus", and are activated by digital command. Trying to diagnose these is bad enough, but many manufacturers have made the information "proprietary" requiring a fee to non dealers. We use ECM rebuilders for replacements, as the salvage yards around here don't have any. If the problem that killed the original ECM isn't found and fixed, the replacement will be turned into a paperweight as soon as it is plugged in. Chrysler has blamed the Japanese tsunami for the defective chips. They are used to position the headrest in the event the airbag system detects a crash. Frankly, I am not a Chrysler fan, as we see way too many of their vehicles in our shop. Our shop truck, an '07 Dodge, has already required replacement of most of the front end parts, including the wheel bearings. If Fiat doen't get their quality problems fixed, they are headed for big trouble. They are resisting the recall of the Jeeps because the gas tank mimics the same location that made the Ford Pinto a death trap. I think the answer to your question is that none of today's cars will be here, or fondly remembered in 25 years. Of course, that goes for many of us, as well!
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TomO |
07-06-2013 @ 9:04 AM
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Bob, have you ever thought of what is going to happen to these vehicles as they approach 25 years? A neighbor had to scr*p a very nice 1993 Cadillac because the ECM was bad and the shop could not find one in the scr*p yard or find any one to repair it. My son had to hunt all over the US for the module that controls the climate control in his 1997 Mark VII. It took 3 months to find one. What is going to happen to all of these hybrids when the batteries die? Chrysler just recalled a bunch of cars because the computer module in the head rest may malfunction in a collision. Why they need a computer module in the head rest is beyond my comprehension.
Tom
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supereal |
07-05-2013 @ 2:55 PM
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No, Tom. My mistakes are one heck of a lot higher than that. As frequent posters, you and I are certainly aware that trying to diagnose problems at a distance is usually a 50/50 proposition, at best. My dad used to say it was "like trying to judge a pig in a barrel". At our shop, we see plenty of jobs that perplexed others, including some dealers. Even with the OBD scans, some elude conventional diagnosis. We are headed to an era where vehicles will be plugged into a master computer back at the factory, and a list of repairs will emerge. The days of Gus Wilson and the Model Garage are long gone! Bob S.
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