| joe b | -- 09-08-2015 @ 1:45 PM |
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My '41 has a rebuilt engine with 1868 miles on it. I have noticed an odd starting problem. Twice after a drive of about 20 and 40 miles and then turning the engine off I have tried to restart it. The starter cranks a few times then it acts like a dead battery. Engine temp is 190 degrees. After it sits for about 20 to 30 minutes with the hood up and temp drops to 160 to 170 degrees it starts right up. Two cranks and it fires up. Any ideas?
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| MG | -- 09-08-2015 @ 2:02 PM |
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Were it me, the first thing I would do is to cleanup the battery posts and cables....
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| joe b | -- 09-09-2015 @ 7:32 AM |
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MG Thanks for the reply. Battery is new and checks out. All wires and grounds from it are good, clean and tight. This is why I think this is odd.
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| cliftford | -- 09-09-2015 @ 9:03 AM |
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With the info you have given,I would suspect the starter motor itself. Do a voltage drop test. If it drops more than 1 volt, assuming it is 6v, pull it out and do further tests. Any good manual will tell you how.
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| joe b | -- 09-09-2015 @ 9:55 AM |
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OK will check and report back.
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| TomO | -- 09-10-2015 @ 7:46 AM |
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A voltage drop test will tell you if you have excessive resistance in the starter circuit. The test will not determine the condition of the starter, you have to do a current draw test to determine that. Even if you have a new battery, it could have gone bad. To do a quick check, do a load test by connecting your voltmeter to the battery posts and cranking the engine with the starter and the ignition switch off. The meter should read more than 4.7 volts while cranking. To do the voltage drop test, connect the COM or black lead of your meter to the battery post, not the cable and the + or red lead to the starter terminal. Crank the engine with the ignition switch off and read the meter. It should read less than 0.5 volts. If it reads more than that, check the cables for the correct size for 6 volts and for corrosion in the starter circuit. You should also do a ground circuit voltage drop test by connecting the red lead of your meter to the POS post of the battery and the COM lead to the case of the starter. The meter should read 0.2 or less. If it is greater, check the grounding surfaces, grounding cables and connections. A current draw test requires a meter that can handle high current. It is better to remove the starter and have it tested at an automotive electric repair facility. Tom
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| joe b | -- 09-11-2015 @ 7:31 AM |
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Well, the starter checks out OK. The guy at the starter shop said that he thinks the engine is still tight with the rebuild. When hot, things expand. Then when it cools some, it cranks OK. I rather doubt this. Am going to have another check done by someone else.
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| supereal | -- 09-12-2015 @ 11:49 AM |
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Yes, a freshly overhauled engine may be a bit tight, particularly if set up to modern, instead of proper clearances. If the starter hasn't been serviced for a long time, that may be involved. The starter gets very hot from the engine, and becomes weak as the coil resistance increases and reduces the current flow. We just repaired a car with your problem, and found the battery was weak and went flat after trying to run the starter. A new Optima battery was the cure. With 800 cold cranking amps, it really spins the engine. Be sure the small brace from the starter to an oil pan bolt is there to prevent movement that can force the starter drive into the ring gear nd binds it.
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| joe b | -- 09-12-2015 @ 1:30 PM |
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Thanks, Super I was hoping you would chime in. The battery is new. The starter was serviced early last year and has around 2200 miles on it. I do have the starter to pan brace. I did not do the rebuild so have no idea how the engine clearances were set up. It just may be a clearance problem making the engine a bit tight since it cranks freely after a short cool down.
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| alanwoodieman | -- 09-12-2015 @ 2:24 PM |
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check the battery cables themselves for bad connections on the ends, make sure connections are tight on al cables under hood, starter solenoid, starter and ground cables. try operating the solenoid under the hood by pushing on the button with the engine hot-had one instance of not starting hot because the coils in the solenoid were loosing conductivity when hot. when trying to start hot engine get someone to fell the cables for excessive heat-if you find one that is the problem
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| joe b | -- 09-12-2015 @ 3:37 PM |
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Thanks,Alan. I will try the under hood solenoid next time. I completely overlooked that! Will report back.
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| TomO | -- 09-13-2015 @ 7:51 AM |
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Joe, The tests that I gave you in my previous post do not have to be made when the engine is hot enough to fail and they will tell you the condition of the battery and cables. Tom
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| joe b | -- 09-13-2015 @ 3:28 PM |
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Thanks, Tom. Will Do and report back.
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| timcolr | -- 09-15-2015 @ 5:49 AM |
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Just an idea to throw at it, check the timing it may have moved a couple of degrees to far advanced. I've had that get me in the past. Tim 1950 Fordor Deluxe 6
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| joe b | -- 09-15-2015 @ 6:52 AM |
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Thanks, Tim. Checked timing and it is OK. Hasn't moved.
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| 37 Coupe | -- 09-15-2015 @ 7:22 AM |
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Something else to check out is the starter to oil pan area. I had similar starting symptoms after engine rebuild/restoration. I had repainted oil pan and this insulated ground evidently where starter mounts to pan and even the small bracket,starter to pan/engine. Why it was intermittent I don't know but cleaning paint off solved my starting problems.
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| joe b | -- 09-15-2015 @ 11:12 AM |
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Thanks 37. Good Idea. I painted everything pretty heavy. Will clean everything so there is a good ground.
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| 37 Coupe | -- 09-15-2015 @ 6:17 PM |
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Something else I just remembered I did was added a ground cable to an existing hole in the frame to oil pan bolt or mayby it was head of long starter bolt.I don't remember but I will look tomorrow.This may work better for you than taking starter off and scr*ping paint.
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