| barrhavencobra | -- 02-07-2015 @ 5:11 PM |
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A couple of months ago I bought my 1947, I will need new tires to get it certified and on the road in the spring. I am keeping it original, but was considering whether I should purchase radial tires verses bias ply. Other than not being period correct a their any other views or thoughts? Has anyone switch, what is the big difference? Thanks in advance, Jim
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| fla48 | -- 02-07-2015 @ 7:07 PM |
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The tires would be your choice. I am running 600/16 bias ply tires on my 48. Another member of our club is running radials on his 46. There are pro's and con's. Some say the handling is better with the radials. There have been several post on the subject. Good luck with the "new" car.
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| len47merc | -- 02-07-2015 @ 8:12 PM |
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Jim, Assume you will have restored your entire suspension to a safe and operable condition by this coming spring to, among other things, realize the full benefit of whatever tire selection you ultimately make. There are many considerations here including judging, handling, look, life, etc. Radials IMHO give varying degrees of 'hot rod' looks to any EFV8. If this is not a problem for you, you may perceive the radials produce a more modern feel and ride and better handling, though all limited by the suspension technology of the time. Also, depending on your radial selection, should you go this route, you likely may realize longer life than with bias plys. If you plan on driving the car the way it was designed to be driven then bias plys will be more than adequate on a car with a suspension in good condition. One may have to true bias plies or go through a few to achieve an optimum ride at or above 55 mph. You will have a smaller footprint with bias plys. Personally have Firestone 710/15 bias plys on a '47 Merc, and though it took a few iterations to get a full set that runs well at a preferred max safe speed of 55-60 mph actual/GPS I love the look and feel. You also may wish to consider the height of the tires you choose as any deviation from the original height will change your final gear ratio. This will in turn affect your rpms and speedo reading at any given speed. Running the 710s versus the original 650s lowered my rpms by ~350 at 55-60 mph while maintained the zippiness around town with a 3.78 rear gear. You may or may not have clearance issues with radials and/or non-original height tires. Some clearance issues may not show themselves until the tires are in use (backing at full turn, etc.). If judging and points are of concern then you will have to weigh the potential point loss for non-period correct tires against the other considerations above and those of others as well as your personal preferences. If you want some of both worlds original-look bias ply radials are available - I have no experience with these. Whitewalls? Hope this helps - Congrats on your new purchase! Steve This message was edited by len47merc on 2-8-15 @ 5:50 AM
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| barrhavencobra | -- 02-08-2015 @ 4:44 AM |
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Thanks for the comments, I welcome more. I am not yet leaning on one side or the other. Steve, definitely whitewalls, I love that look. Jim
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| len47merc | -- 02-08-2015 @ 5:55 AM |
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On the whitewalls, though not having done the research personally I trust the previous input from others on this forum that blackwalls were all that were offered from the factory in '47. If points are a consideration you may wish to investigate whether flexibility exists for the judges for your chosen whitewall. Steve
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| TomO | -- 02-09-2015 @ 8:31 AM |
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I have bias ply tires on both of my Club cars. I have ridden and driven Early Fords with both types of tires. In my mind, I could not justify the extra cost of a quality white wall radial tire with the cost of the bias ply tires. I drive my cars about 2,000 miles a year, so wearing out the tires is not a consideration. They will have to be replaced due to age well before they wear out. I don't know the regulations about tires where you live, but around the Chicago area, it is difficult to find someone to work on a tire more than 7 years old. We don't have inspections. Tom
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| Drbrown | -- 02-12-2015 @ 10:31 PM |
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Re use of whitewall tires, the Early Ford V8 Club book page 4-14 reports no white wall tires until early 1947, but becoming available in early '47 coincident with Ford's "face lift" promotion. Re type, previous owner of my '47 installed Coker Classic polyester 78-15 WW Bias ply. They show little wear because of low use. Only one of them was out-of-balance when checked. I've driven up to abt 75 mph (have OD) and the tires/car drive and handle well. I believe 70-75 mph is beyond the intended/expected speed range for these cars and I normally don't exceed abt 60 mph. However, at regular hwy speeds I notice the front tires and/or steering apparatus "prefer" to follow any groves or edges in the pavement surfaces, much like a rear-wheel drive car resists climbing back up-onto the edge of the pavement along the shoulder of a road. In cars I drive with radial tires I don't notice that habit. Regardless, that characteristic is not detrimental to my enjoyment in driving the car and will not cause me to convert to radials. Perhaps when they are due for change I may consider radials. This message was edited by Drbrown on 2-21-15 @ 3:06 PM
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| len47merc | -- 02-13-2015 @ 5:56 AM |
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Drbrown - that is a good read/catch and I am neglect for not researching my own copy of the '41-'48 Ford Book before responding earlier. As my plans were then to limit judging on my '47 to 'Rouge Class - Interior' I only skimmed this section and missed this whitewall reference. Luckily, with input from others on this forum I ended up with Firestone 3 1/4" whitewalls, and reading further and closer last night on pages 4-14 thru 4-15 the book goes on to say '...white sidewalls, when available, were one sided only, 3 1/4" wide'. barrhavencobra's potential use (and thankfully mine) of whitewalls on a '47 are a stronger possibility, particularly for cars with window bug date codes of April '47 (initiation of face lift program) and after. Unfortunately for me all my '47's (Merc) original glass window codes are consistently from January of '47, speedo/radio/clock codes are from December of '46, the serial number is one of the absolute last from '46 and it has a combo of '46 & '47 exterior trim that I (and EFV8 Club technical adviser Rusty Davis) perceive are fully original (due to the timing and location of the build) but cannot conclusively validate; hence the decision not to pursue exterior judging and no worries about having to justify any potential whitewall date conflict. In the end, if points are a concern it would appear barrhavencobra should have no worries here if all his window bug codes, critical dates and numbers are for April '47 and after and he uses 3 1/4" whitewalls. The book suggests some flexibility for use of whitewalls may exist for Jan-Mar '47. Personally, I like the whitewall look so much that if the car is submitted for exterior judging down the road I plan to accept any points deduction as the cost of personal preference. Steve This message was edited by len47merc on 2-13-15 @ 6:01 AM
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| Drbrown | -- 02-13-2015 @ 8:04 PM |
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len47merc .... my '47 is a good driver but would not survive any serious judging. My only readable glass bugs are both rear seat hinged vents which are by Ford and say May '47 and exhibit bubbling along edges. The door glass including their vents are unlabeled so they must be replacements. The curved rear window glass window is labeled Herculite but Herculite did not include a date. The windshield plates are (1) de-laminating undated "Duplate" by PG [Pittsburg Glass] and (2) undated LOF [Libby-Owens-Ford) "Hi-Test Safety". I have not de-coded the embossed numbering/lettering on the fire wall. I like the whitewall look too, especially with a dark maroon body color. You've got me wondering if my Firestone's are one-sided WW. Have only had car 1-1/2 yrs so never noticed.
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| barrhavencobra | -- 02-15-2015 @ 11:53 AM |
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Helle Steve and others, I appreciate your comment re rebuilding suspension before I get her on the road this spring, is there a reference where I can go to see what needs to be done? Thanks Jim
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| barrhavencobra | -- 02-15-2015 @ 11:59 AM |
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Helle Steve and others, I appreciate your comment re rebuilding suspension before I get her on the road this spring, is there a reference where I can go to see what needs to be done? Thanks Jim
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| len47merc | -- 02-15-2015 @ 3:17 PM |
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Jim - the Ford/MERCURY 1942-1948 SHOP MANUAL/Service Handbook should give you most all the technical info you need. The reason for the suspension suggestion, beyond basic & fundamental safety, is your investment in tires is likely to be substantial and you do not want to have worn components wearing them out prematurely, or give you the impression you have a new tire problem when a suspension component is at fault. King pins/spindle components, bushings, drag link, torsion & stabilizer bars, radius rod ball, tie rod ends (ball joints), shocks, etc., one, some or all may or may not need work to: 1) Make your car safe and comfortable to drive and 2) Protect your investment in those expensive whitewalls. Depending upon your comfort level and skill set in working with your suspension components/diagnosing areas of concern, and before you make any investment in parts, you may find value in having a front end/suspension specialist local to you who is conversant in classics/vintage autos/Fords to review your '47 and advise you what you may need. This may save you $$$'s in the long-run. Some components require machine shop work &/or special tools to be installed safely, properly & correctly. Steve This message was edited by len47merc on 2-15-15 @ 3:50 PM
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| barrhavencobra | -- 02-16-2015 @ 5:40 PM |
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Thanks Steve, I very much appreciate the heads up and suggestions. I have a couple old cars and never sell so I want to spend the time to make them right for the long time. Jim
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| len47merc | -- 02-16-2015 @ 6:04 PM |
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You're welcome Jim. Others on this site have far more experience, resources and knowledge than I've been able to develop thus far with my '47. For peace of mind I went through the entire suspension upon receipt/before putting it on the road, using only the referenced '42-'48 Shop Manual/Service Handbook and did some of the work myself, leaving the king pins, spring bushings, shocks and rear shackles to professionals experienced in vintage Fords with the equipment to do the jobs safely and correctly. Perhaps others have better &/or more specific documentation and recommendations than that I have referenced to help you go through your suspension analysis and restoration. Good luck - be interested to know what you finally select for your tires and what your thoughts are about them after your first few road tests. Steve This message was edited by len47merc on 2-16-15 @ 6:19 PM
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