| CraigTerry | -- 08-09-2014 @ 9:36 PM |
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Found some antifreeze under my muffler, pulled the head and this is what I found. Interested in your thoughts.
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| CraigTerry | -- 08-09-2014 @ 9:37 PM |
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Here's another pic
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| CraigTerry | -- 08-09-2014 @ 9:38 PM |
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Here's another pic This message was edited by CraigTerry on 8-9-14 @ 9:39 PM
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| CraigTerry | -- 08-09-2014 @ 9:39 PM |
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Oops here it is
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| Norm | -- 08-10-2014 @ 7:08 AM |
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Somehow, water (antifreeze) is getting in that cylinder. The most likely candidate is the gasket, but don't rule out cracks. The water in the combustion space results in less carbon formation. Back in the day people used water injection bottles (set up like a top end oiler) to try for this effect.
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| cliftford | -- 08-10-2014 @ 7:32 AM |
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I would clean thr block surfaces, pull the studs and magnaflux the block, paying close attention to the area around the valves, just to be sure there are no cracks.
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| trjford8 | -- 08-10-2014 @ 7:37 AM |
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Have someone check the head for cracks and also run a straight edge across the head to see if it needs surfacing.
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| drkbp | -- 08-10-2014 @ 6:58 PM |
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Craig, You said you had coolant under your muffler. Is that correct? If so, I am not sure I understand why the head is off. If coolant is on the floor: At least through the 1937's, coolant will tend to drip on the starter and then run down on the floor of the garage. If it is on the passenger side it is very likely the pan rail plugs. There are two on each side. They were put in for casting reasons and I don't believe they are a true freeze plug. I have the right rear one weeping a very small amount of coolant. I put some Bahrs leak in it three or four months ago and I haven't seen anything since. I will try to post a picture of a '37 block. I haven't posted a picture before. If that is not what you were after I apologize. Ken in Texas
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| CraigTerry | -- 08-10-2014 @ 8:46 PM |
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Ken I pulled the head because I'm under the impression either i have a blown head gasket, cracked head or worse. It appears when looking at the pistons and valves that water has entered the combustion chamber (clean piston heads, white valves). The confusing thing is the spark plugs are black with carbon. The block is a 37 and I'm running straight dual exhaust. The passenger exhaust smokes (white) and spits water pretty bad. Enough water to saturate a paper towel. Once she warms up she'll overheat at idle and slow speeds but temp comes down while at cruising speeds. Any suggestions on cleaning the block water ports?
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| TomO | -- 08-11-2014 @ 5:32 AM |
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It looks like the head gasket failed. You can see signs of rusty water around the 2 cylinders. I would do as TRJ suggested. I would also check the deck for cracks around the valves. There is no good way to clean the water passages without disassembling the motor, but you can try Evaporuust in the block and then flush it. I would not use it in the radiator, although others have. Tom
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| drkbp | -- 08-11-2014 @ 5:37 AM |
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Craig, I missed you were talking about water out the tail pipe. Ken in Texas
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| CraigTerry | -- 08-11-2014 @ 9:29 PM |
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NO problem Ken, took head down to be magnafluxed. I think I'll use evaporust in the block to help clean up some of the rust.
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| carguy | -- 08-12-2014 @ 12:09 PM |
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I'm considering doing the Evaporust thing also in my '34. I read here that TomO cautioned about using it in the radiator. How are you going to go about using the Evaporust? Bill Brown '34 Cabriolet
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| CraigTerry | -- 08-12-2014 @ 7:00 PM |
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My plan is to drain the radiator, pull the upper and lower hoses and plug the lower. Not sure what with just yet but I'm sure it'll involve Duct Tape (lol). Then I'll fill the head and block by pouring the evaporust in the water pump till full. Plan on letting it sit for a couple of days and then I'll pull the plug, drain, rinse, rinse and rinse.
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| fla48 | -- 08-12-2014 @ 7:20 PM |
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Evaporust makes two different products for cleaning the inside of the engine and radiator, one for removing rust and scale and another for removing rust and cleaning the radiator. I have used both with great success. Both require you to operate the engine at normal operating temperature to function properly and come with explicit directions. These two products do not harm the radiator. I had to order it on line as the local auto parts stores here only handle the regular rust remover. Check their web site for details.
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| supereal | -- 08-12-2014 @ 7:46 PM |
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Those plugs on the bottom of the block where the pan attaches are actually core plugs to allow removal of the casting sand. Same is true of "freeze plugs". When we boil blocks at our shop we remove them to be sure the interior of the block is fully free of sand, rust, and other debris. Usually these plugs are in poor shape, just ready to leak.
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| TomO | -- 08-13-2014 @ 7:01 AM |
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My caution about using any chemical in the radiator, is that some of the debris could plug the radiator, or open up a leak that has been sealed with a sealer. I prefer to have a good radiator shop clean my radiator. Re-cores with the louver fins are too expensive to take chances on. Tom
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| CraigTerry | -- 08-15-2014 @ 1:21 PM |
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Question what do you guys use to remove the old gasket material from the block. How do you prevent debris from getting into the open valves and piston shafts.
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| 39topless | -- 08-20-2014 @ 12:12 PM |
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Debris shouldn't get any farther down the piston cylinder than the top of the piston but it will go down into the valve holes. How about working on one cylinder at a time and rotate the crank until the valves are closed? Just a thought.
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| TomO | -- 08-24-2014 @ 10:07 AM |
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Keep a vacuum cleaner handy and vacuum the debris before you rotate the engine. Tom
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| len47merc | -- 08-24-2014 @ 2:41 PM |
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To TomO's point, keep your Shop Vac on and the crevasse nozzle directly beside your scr*ping tool and vacuum debris up before it hits the cylinders that have been rotated to close the valves. Steve
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| CraigTerry | -- 09-10-2014 @ 1:06 PM |
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Ok , I had the heads checked and machined flat. Replaced the head gasket with copper gaskets. Cleaned cooling system with evaporust and the flushed. Replaced head studs using stainless allthread rod cut to length. Torgued all head bolts to 55lbs. I still have fluid coming out of exhaust. I have excellent vacuum, engine runs fine, no miss, low compression in one of the cylinders. No water in oil. Block has surface crack between large coolant ports and fine crack to cylinder but doesn't penetrate cylinder jacket. Also this is not the cylinder with low compression. I have water weeping from one of the head studs. Any experts out there that can give me advice?
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| carcrazy | -- 09-10-2014 @ 1:39 PM |
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How long have you let the engine run? The fluid coming out of the exhaust may just be condensation which will stop being produced once the engine has reached operating temperature. For the stud which has a coolant leak, I would remove that stud and coat the bottom threads (which screw into the block) with Permatex #2 and reinstall the stud into the block. Drain the coolant from the engine before doing the stud removal. Please let us know if this solves your concerns.
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| CraigTerry | -- 09-10-2014 @ 2:02 PM |
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I let the engine run for quite a while. It's not condensation it's the 50/50 mix from the cooling system. As for the weeping stud I coated the end of it with liquid Teflon - hoping that would stop it, all it did was slow it down. I'm thinking I'm going to pull the head, pull all studs, seal the bottoms of all of them with a thread sealer and lightly groove out the crack and put some JB Weld in it. Again open to experienced advice.
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| CraigTerry | -- 09-10-2014 @ 2:25 PM |
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One more thing - i used copper gaskets and did not use any additional sealer on the gasket. Should I have?
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| TomO | -- 09-11-2014 @ 7:27 AM |
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It sounds like you may have a crack going to an exhaust port. Borrow or rent a cylinder leak-down tester to determine which cylinder is at fault before pulling the heads again. I prefer the composition head gaskets for good sealing. Tom This message was edited by TomO on 9-11-14 @ 7:32 AM
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