| watwasithinking | -- 12-11-2009 @ 9:18 AM |
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Recently I installed a restored Philco model FT-9 AM radio in my 1936 Coupe. I attached the radio's antenna lead to the antenna lead located in the base of the left windshield pillar only to realize that this lead led to no where. I am seeking information in regards to installing the correct antenna configuration. I never see restored cars with radios utilizing the conventional cowl mounted antenna mast. In keeping my car correctly restored, what are my options...the hidden spare tire antenna or running board antenna? For the best reception I realize the cowl mounted antenna would provide the best signal reception.
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| supereal | -- 12-11-2009 @ 9:28 AM |
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There were a variety of antenna configurations used over the years. These included using the chicken wire under the soft top, the running board type, the antenna at the center top of the windshield and, of course, the cowl or front fender whip. I'm not a '36 expert, but most of the "correct" cars seem to use the running board type. Of all these types, the cowl side mount is probably the most effective. Most, if not all, car radios were installed by local dealers, and the antenna selection varied as much as the radio brands.
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| wmsteed | -- 12-11-2009 @ 10:20 AM |
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All closed cars were pre-wired from the factory. The lead located in the left cowl goes to the roof antenna with an attachment to the wire mesh in the top assembly. The Ford cars prior to '37 did not use the windshield header antenna.. Cowl mounted "whip" antenna's were not a Ford item, however a lot were used by the aftermarket vendors. The spare tire antenna was used on the open cars from 1933 to April '36. With the introduction of the trunk on the 4 door convertibles in April '36, the spare tire antenna was discontinued in favor of the "Roadway", running board, antenna. The running board antenna was a piece of junk... being subject to all the ravages of road damage. If you insist on using a Roadway antenna, your radio has to be "tuned" for same. The original roof antenna's were great, because they utilize the magnetic field of the vehicle to increase reception. If you roof antenna is not working that means one of several things. e.g. There is no mesh in your top or the wire was not attached to the mesh when a new top was installed. If you opt for a cowl mounted whip antenna, mount it to the right side (passenger) in lieu of street side. The modern whip antenna's do not hook up like the old antenna's, you will have to make up an adapter going from the plug in female connector to a twist lock female connector. The twist lock connectors look like a two prong fuse connector. I would advise you to purchase 1935-36 Ford Book from the Early Ford V-8 Club. This book contains the very detailed instructions/drawings showing the necessary steps to eliminate noise in the radio that is caused by the generator, etc. Properly installed the Ford Philco radios were great, the one in my '36 will pull in stations from great distances. On the open hiway I have listened to stations from the mid west, which is 2,500 miles away. If you have not done so, I would advise you to use a solid state vibrator in lieu of the original style. The radio will draw less amps/volatage and work better. Bill 36 5 win delx cpe
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| watwasithinking | -- 12-11-2009 @ 1:44 PM |
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Thank you for the info.
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| watwasithinking | -- 12-11-2009 @ 1:51 PM |
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Looks like I need to get busy dropping the headlining. Thank you for the information.
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| flatheadfan | -- 12-12-2009 @ 5:39 AM |
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Below is a copy of an item I posted on Fordbarn in response to a discussion regarding radio antennas. If you read it previously you may want to skip this if not, read away...... Guys- Recently, there has been some discussion about under running board antennas. Let me throw out a couple of ideas that you may (or may not) find useful. I have a '35 coupe and like most '35-'36 closed cars an antenna was built-in at the factory. Unfortunately, over time the antenna lead (which goes down the inside left-hand pillar), has been frayed or broken off which necessitates a "Plan B." With that in mind, let me pass on some of my experiences. You can use a "modern" type of antenna under the running board. This can be done by simply making a bracket, attaching it to the juncture of the front fender and the running board and then simply running the cable inside the frame and up and through a hole in the wooden floor board. The problem with this approach is that the mounting quickly becomes a depository of road grime and quasi-sandblasting thrown up by the front tire. To minimize damage I have done two things namely, build a box around the end of the mounting (see picture) and added a splash shield inside the front fender. Works great and reception is very good. Note picture below The second approach is a copy of the typical old-style running board antenna (see picture). It actually is very simple to make and does work surprisingly well. The trick is to isolate the antenna from the body and frame. A simple way to isolate the tubing from potentially grounding is by the use of plastic water pipe where the mounting brackets are attached. Unfortunately, some of the dimensions are not clear in the drawing. The needed materials are: 76" of 1/4" aluminum tubing 11"-12" of 1/2" hard plastic tubing 2 pieces of 1/8" stock steel plates cut to 3"x 3" radio antenna lead, attaching hardware. Note picture below. There are probably other ideas floating around out there which may even be better than what I am suggesting but these approaches do work. Hope this helps. Your comments are appreciated. Tom This message was edited by flatheadfan on 12-12-09 @ 5:40 AM
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| flatheadfan | -- 12-12-2009 @ 5:44 AM |
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Picture #2
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| flatheadfan | -- 12-12-2009 @ 5:44 AM |
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Picture #3
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| admiral1960 | -- 12-12-2009 @ 7:02 AM |
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I repainted my 35 FORDOR DELUXE SEDAN about 7-10 years ago and replced top and interior at the same time. A muffler shop had started a fire while installing a new exhaust system. In the process I removed the overhead wood bows and chicken wire. The chicken wire also gives support to the top (I believe). The antenna wire was soldered to the chicken wire and ran down the door piller to where it connected to the radio. I unsoldered the antenna and cannot remember if there was a sheild that was grounded. I do mot think so but maybe another member can address that issue. I replaced the orinal wire with identical or something very close as far as the size of the mesh. I belive the hole sise was 2-3 inches. You may have nothing more to do than resolder the wire to what is up there now. I wanted to try a wire with a tighter mesh and see if the reception was better but did not take the time. Maybe someone has experimented with a tighter mesh wire like you would use in a rabbit hutch. I agree about replacing the vibrator with a solid state one. Be sure to get a positive ground one assuming you are still 6 Volt + ground. 6 volt negitive ground vibrators are also available. I can provide a web site if interested. This was my experience, hope ti helps. Allen E Michler AW1, USNR (10 yrs) LTC, TC, USAR (29 yrs)
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| wmsteed | -- 12-12-2009 @ 8:14 AM |
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The correct antenna wire for the EV-8's is a shielded wire, e.g. braided wire on the outside, insulated wire on the inside. Modern lead in wire wire can be used in lieu of the original style... the trick to either wire is that the braided shielding wire has to be grounded. The lead in wire going to the wire mesh in the top has the shielded wire attached to the wire mesh via soldiering and the braided wire attached to the body. I would say that the running board antenna's are OK in a metro area.... my fathers NEW 1940 Chevy had one, it worked good in town (Los Angeles) however when we would head out on a trip to Idaho/Utah, we got mostly static. The '38 Chevy I had in 1949 was the same way, so I replaced the running board unit with a cowl mounted whip. The one thing that most people don't understand about antenna's is that the vehicle body is the most important part of the system, that is why Ford used the wire mesh in the top, just like GM used the antenna embedded in the windshield in the late 70's, early 80's Bill 36 5 win delx cpe
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| watwasithinking | -- 12-12-2009 @ 9:27 AM |
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Thanks to each of you that have responded to my antenna question. I have obtained some good solid information from each response. My radio was restored by Earl Boyle of No. Canton, Ohio. Earl does excellent work. He went completely through the receiver and did replace the vibrator with a solid state one. I was not aware that solid state vibrators pulled less amperage. The idea of making a smaller antenna grid using hardware cloth in lieu of chicken wire has perked my interest. I will experiment with the two and report back.Thank you to all that responded. Thomas
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| admiral1960 | -- 12-12-2009 @ 3:21 PM |
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I wonder if regular coax would work? It has the center lead and a wire mesh shield that could be attached on both ends to the frame. Allen E Michler AW1, USNR (10 yrs) LTC, TC, USAR (29 yrs)
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| wmsteed | -- 12-13-2009 @ 9:43 AM |
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I guess I should clarify a few things before people get the idea that I am an expert on radio's, which I don't claim to be. When I was in the US Army I went through a school ran by Philco that dealt with fire control systems for anti aircraft defense.. Adding to this knowledge is over 55 years of tinkering with old cars. My radio knowledge is supplimented by a good friend that works on old radios as a hobby. On the wire mesh issue in the tops of the old Fords; The wire used by Ford is not really "chicken wire" this is a slang term used by many people. The wire is usually woven 1"x 20 poultry wire, however 1-1/2" x 17 can also be used. These types of wire are also referred to as "stucco wire". Hardware cloth is a completely different product. It is a square mesh with several sizes of mesh, e.g. 1/4", 3/8", 1/2". The woven type wire mesh is more flexible than hardware cloth, therefore it conforms to the body shape better. I am not trying to be overly picky about the wire mesh variations, I am just trying to supply proper info in what to look for when you go to the hardware store. If you go to one of the big box stores, Home Depot, etc. the average guy (girl) on the floor will have no clue what you are looking for. One must keep in mind the importance of maintaining the receptive field of the base vehicle, while not creating a directional antenna. Modern coax cable is much smaller than antique radio antenna wire, I am not sure if the impedance (obstruction, resistance) would be correct for AM radio. I come from the school of.... if it ain't broken, don't fix it. Foote note: We just went through the wire mesh issue on my brothers '35 4dr sdn. We used 1"x 20 wire, it laid down nice and flat. Bill 36 5 win delx cpe
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