| dso72 | -- 10-22-2009 @ 11:54 AM |
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I'm looking at buying a LB engine out of a 1936. It was rebuilt a few years ago and has ~6000 miles on it. What should I be looking for when purchasing this item? One head has been removed and you can still see the hone marks in the cylinder.The engine had a compression check and had a week cylinder. Owner did a 2 angle valve grind and all cylinders are at 105. I'm new to the hobby and any help would be greatly appreciated.
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| MOXIE | -- 10-22-2009 @ 2:57 PM |
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What do you mean by a 2 angle valve grind.
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| dso72 | -- 10-22-2009 @ 3:46 PM |
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MOXIE, A multi angle valve grind increases head flow and performance. This usually entails placing different angles on the valve seat itself, increasing the flow of combustion gases and improving horsepower and torque. A multi angle valve grind is the cutting or grinding of 2 or more angles on the seat and valve.
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| TomO | -- 10-22-2009 @ 4:13 PM |
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It is very difficult to assess the condition of an engine that is not running. If you really want the engine, you will have to take a chance on the honesty of the seller. Tom
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| ford38v8 | -- 10-22-2009 @ 8:41 PM |
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dso, Tom said it very well, but something you said about the condition gets me: you said the cylinders still show the hone marks. After 6K miles, if it hasn't broken in yet, the previous owner may have been using synthetic oil, which is never recommended for a break-in period. A multi-angle valve grind is, I believe, just a new moniker for an old fashioned port & polish. This is something best left to a machine shop, as too many flat motors have been destroyed by backyard mechanics wanting to "Improve" the flathead's flow. Alan
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| 51f1 | -- 10-23-2009 @ 4:11 AM |
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I have seen older engines that still have hone marks on the cylinder walls that had nothing to do with synthetic oil. Recently I saw an article that said that synthetic oil would not inhibit break-in. I am not familiar with a 2-angle valve seat. A three angle valve seat is ground at 30, 45 and 60 degrees to improve air flow and to eliminate sharp edges which could cause hot spots. Originally the flathead had only a 45 degree cut which would be more than sufficient. Richard
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| supereal | -- 10-23-2009 @ 8:03 AM |
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We do use the two angle grind on valves at our shop to increase flow over the new valve seats. If you or your shop aren't familiar with this procedure, stick with the one angle. The term "rebuilt" can be misleading. Why was the engine removed? If the hone marks are still visible after 6,000 miles, I doubt the engine has been run that much, regardless of the type of oil. I'd be doubly cautious if the engine is a babbit bearing type. The compression reading is good, but when you are buying an engine you have not heard running, more often than not the "rebuild" resulted in some kind of problem.
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| MOXIE | -- 10-23-2009 @ 3:04 PM |
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Hearing one run is no guarantee. I purchase a 35 engine and drove the car before I brought the engine. The guy was making a rod out of it and did not need the engine. Engine ran great, but with every engine I buy, I like to remove the heads and flush the block out. Guess what. Found a crack near the cylinder hole, plus all cylinders were bored out as far as they will go. It is just pure luck getting a good one when you buy an engine.
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| supereal | -- 10-24-2009 @ 10:44 AM |
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Can't argue with that, but hearing an engine run still increase the probability that it is worth considering. We find cracks in just about every flathead block we check with our MagnaFlux machine. If they are not open into the water jacket, we drill and pin the cracks, then resurface the block to save it. One advantage in running the engine is to see if it overheats quickly. That usually indicates internal leakage. If anyone wants to see how the repair looks, we have photos of the results. If you can't pull the heads before you lay your money down, the asking price should be really cheap.
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| parrish | -- 10-25-2009 @ 6:09 AM |
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Supereal: I'd like to see those photos...how best to get them?
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| parrish | -- 10-25-2009 @ 6:10 AM |
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Supereal: I'd like to see those photos...how best to get them?
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| supereal | -- 10-25-2009 @ 9:16 AM |
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I can e-mail them with your address, or snail mail them if you prefer.
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| lightflyer1 | -- 10-25-2009 @ 11:18 AM |
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Please include me! dje@austin.rr.com
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| supereal | -- 10-26-2009 @ 9:15 AM |
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Will do. If I could master photo posting, I'd do it here. Many have never seen a successful crack repair, but it is necessary to salvage an otherwise defective block.
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| rlh37ford | -- 10-30-2009 @ 6:02 PM |
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Hi Super: Would you please send your repair photos to me at rlhate@ptd.net? Many, many thanks. Dick.
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| MOXIE | -- 10-30-2009 @ 9:03 PM |
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Shops have said they can repair a crack, but I have never seen one that worked. The only good repair is weld. And then you have to heat the whole block for it to work.
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| 51f1 | -- 10-31-2009 @ 3:22 AM |
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Has anyone ever seen a flathead block that wasn't cracked? Cracks can be successfully repaired like Supereal describes. Welding cast iron is not easy. Richard
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| supereal | -- 10-31-2009 @ 9:46 AM |
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Welding large cast iron pieces, such as an engine block, requires heating the block to a very high temperature, even when the special rods are used. We do it with smaller articles, but drill and pin most cracks. It takes practice and skill, but we have yet to see a properly pinned crack come back. If they fail, it is because the crack was not properly assessed as fixable.
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