| sarahcecelia | -- 04-30-2021 @ 6:10 AM |
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The reasons that flat heads run a little hot, are two fold-First is Poor design- the exhaust ports on the block for cylinder #'s 2 and 3 and 6 and 7 are side by side, and second is people want to use 180 degree thermostats. Ford recommended 160 degree thermostats for all flat heads to compensate for the design "error!" Regards, Steve Lee This message was edited by sarahcecelia on 4-30-21 @ 6:12 AM
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| 51woodie | -- 04-30-2021 @ 7:37 AM |
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Interesting. When I got my stock 46 Coupe, it had 160s in it. One was in place and the other was cocked in the hose. I installed new 160s, and the engine ran at 160. Too cold in my mind. I changed to 180s, and it runs at 180. Might creep up to 185 in stop and go traffic.
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| TomO | -- 04-30-2021 @ 8:57 AM |
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Thermostats have little effect on overheating. From the 1953 Mercury Shop Manual: "The purpose of the thermostat is to control the minimum temperature the the engine will run at". 160 thermostats were specified for alcohol based antifreeze, which was still very common until after 1953. 180 thermostats were specified for "permanent" anti freeze (glycol based coolant). Tom
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| MG | -- 04-30-2021 @ 10:57 AM |
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Tom, please expound on this - alcohol based antifreeze vs. "permanent" anti freeze (glycol based coolant). Why the different operating temperatures between these two? BTW - I use 160 degree thermostats using plain water. The car runs all day at 160 but I'm contemplating installing 180's. This message was edited by MG on 4-30-21 @ 11:53 AM
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| TomO | -- 04-30-2021 @ 12:22 PM |
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Alcohol antifreeze has a lower boiling point, about 170F, than glycol based anti freeze, more than 300F. Tom This message was edited by TomO on 5-1-21 @ 8:06 AM
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| sarahcecelia | -- 04-30-2021 @ 6:18 PM |
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I think that's a little backward. It is a proven fact that Ethaline Glycol will hold heat; Example: if you run straight Ethaline Glycol in a cooling system "your engine will overheat!' Many fools 'back in the day" did just that and OVERHEATED!! That's why the companys like Prestone now offer 50/50; (it's for the "Dummies.") The alternative was Alchohol antifreeze which was cheaper, but you had to dump it after the cold weather was over, because by the next winter it had boiled out through evaporation. Regards, Steve Lee This message was edited by sarahcecelia on 8-18-21 @ 2:33 PM
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| sarahcecelia | -- 04-30-2021 @ 6:26 PM |
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51 Woodie-Your smarter than Ford motor Company?? I hardly think so! They said, "160 DEGREE THERMOSTATS IN ALL FLATHEADS!" That's when they are FULLY OPEN; 160 degrees. They would start to open at about 156 degrees., and when the motor got fully warmed up it would be near 180 degrees. Regards, Steve Lee This message was edited by sarahcecelia on 4-30-21 @ 6:47 PM
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| sarahcecelia | -- 04-30-2021 @ 6:30 PM |
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Tom, I was 16 in 1953, and already fooling around with, and learning the mechanics of cars. Alchohol and Ethaline Glycol were both sold at that time!I used Alchohol because I was short of "Do Re Me" and it was cheaper. Regards, Steve Lee This message was edited by sarahcecelia on 8-18-21 @ 2:34 PM
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| sarahcecelia | -- 04-30-2021 @ 6:32 PM |
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Your gauges are wrong! I have 160's in my Cretliner V8, with 160's, and when warmed up it runs 178-181 degrees! Regards, Steve Lee
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| sarahcecelia | -- 04-30-2021 @ 6:40 PM |
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That's right! Because once they are full open they stay open until you shut the motor down. But when they are fully open and the motor keeps running, the temperature will continually rise until it reaches full operating temperature, of about 180. Regards, Steve Lee
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| sarahcecelia | -- 04-30-2021 @ 6:42 PM |
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You are looking for real trouble running just water!!! Regards, Steve Lee
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| TomO | -- 05-01-2021 @ 8:40 AM |
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Steve, I would like to know where Ford Motor Company said "160 DEGREE THERMOSTATS IN ALL FLATHEADS". All of my literature shows 160 and 180 thermostats as available for Ford products from 1949 and later, to be used with "permanent" antifreeze. The 180 thermostats were available from other suppliers in the early post WWII years and were recommended to be used with "permanent" antifreeze. My Dad's 1946 Lincoln came from the dealer with permanent antifreeze and the 180F thermostats. It was a welcome change from the 1942 Mercury that had alcohol antifreeze. The alcohol antifreeze needed to be checked regularly to make sure that the protection was still adequate and had to be drained and flushed every Spring. The heater also worked much better in the Lincoln with the higher temperature thermostats. By 1953, alcohol based antifreeze was hard to find in northern Illinois and by 1950 most cars were delivered new with permanent antifreeze. Tom
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| 51woodie | -- 05-01-2021 @ 11:52 AM |
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Steve. I never said I was smarter that the Ford Motor Company. In fact, I consider most people, especially on this site, to be smarter than me. I do know that I can read and understand a temperature gauge, and can also recognize when an engine is overheating. I also knew what I had to do with my stock 59AB so it doesn't overheat.
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| hupdoc | -- 06-08-2021 @ 1:52 AM |
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Steve I'm confused about thermostats . Surely the thermostat should not cause over heating . If your car runs at 185 then when it gets to 180 the 180 thermostat will be fully open and hence not causing any obstruction to coolant flow and hence it shouldn't overheat . Provided the thermostat setting is below the running temperature shouldn't you be fine ? Of course running at higher temperatures and getting there quicker ( short of boiling) is supposed to be good for the engine minimising cold wear problems and burning off undesirables as well as maximising engine efficency . Ford fitted the 34's with 150 F thermostats -I've run no thermostats , original 150F, 160 F and now 180F in my 34 Fordor with no overheating problems at all and no change in running temp (albeit on an original dual guage- probably inaccurate but running temp still the same accross all Thermostats )
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| mfirth | -- 06-08-2021 @ 4:37 AM |
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Very interesting, kinda. My 52 8BA ran hotter with 160s in it than it does with 180s. 180s are perfect in my engine. I have a friend with a 1938 stock Phaeton. Don't know what stats he uses, but he has NO FAN & that little flathead never overheats. How's that for interesting?
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| Carcheologist | -- 08-17-2021 @ 5:40 PM |
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As previously stated, temperature markings on thermostats indicate when they are designed to be fully OPEN! That doesn't mean that your engine will be obliged to remain at that temperature after it reaches that point. 160 degree stats open sooner than 180's but if you have a dirty block, heads, radiator, faulty radiator cap or loose fan belt, etc., coolant temperatures can go well above that to the point of pushing coolant out the overflow tube. Several old V8'ers told me over the years that "if you're not spitting coolant on the ground, you're not overheating." I live in Texas where heat is just something we live with. My approach to conquering a tendency for my '40 to run hotter than I like was to remove the thermostats and run straight water with Water Wetter to handle corrosion issues and help water with better heat transfer. The car runs and idles beautifully and only has a tendency to creep up in temperature when allowed to idle excessively. That can be due partly to a problem every '40 & '41 owner has...a crank-mounted fan. I have an analog temp gauge under the dash to monitor coolant temp, and it never exceeds 185 degrees. I'm aware that Ford supplied the Flathead with thermostats and had good reasons for doing so, but this combination works well for me.
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