Topic: Finding top dead center

krwilson5	-- 08-18-2020 @ 6:03 PM
	I'm installing a Mallory electronic distributor to my 59A motor. I need to find top dead center so that I can add a timing mark and indicator. Any suggestions other than using the stock distributor?
51504bat	-- 08-18-2020 @ 7:24 PM
	My old mentor always took out number 1 spark plug and with the ignition off he would place his thumb over the plug hole and slowly crank over the engine until the compression blew his thumb away from the hole. He would then rotate the engine until the timing mark lined up and then set the distributor. That's how we did it on my 8ba but I'm not familiar with earlier flatheads if that is what you are asking about. ______________ No signature
krwilson5	-- 08-18-2020 @ 8:21 PM
	In the case of the 59A and earlier there is no timing mark. It isn't needed because the distributor can only be installed one way with very little timing adjustment possible. I'm trying to establish a mark so that I can use a timing light. It is possible to access the top of the piston to determine tdc on an overhead, but doesn't work with the flathead because the spark plugs are over the valves so there isn't access to the top of the piston.
lawrie	-- 08-19-2020 @ 12:07 AM
	Take the plugs out , turn the motor over with your finger over number one plug hole ,stop when you get on the compression stroke, insert a Zip or cable tie into the plug hole with the latch end of the cable tie inside , push it in towards the exhaust side of the bore bore , turn the motor over by hand until it stops on the cable tie then make a wire pointer,mark the pulley next at the pointer, turn the motor back the opposite way until it stops on the cable tie again, mark the Pully ,then half this and you have top dead centre, Lawrie
TomO	-- 08-19-2020 @ 5:59 AM
	This is from the MG Forum and it works great. ( https://mgaguru.com/mgtech/engine/cs111b.htm ) Phil Parmenter in East Sussex, UK, offers a similar way to do pretty much the same thing with a lot less mess. He writes: "Just found the following on the internet. Sounds like a lot better than pouring oil down the plug hole". 1. Make an indicator from some clear plastic tubing, a jar of light oil, and an old spark plug. 2. Break up an old spark plug and attach a length of clear plastic tubing to it (make it airtight). 3. Remove all the spark plugs. 4. Stick your thumb OVER the #1 cylinder spark plug hole. Rotate the engine (see note below on tricks for this) until you feel pressure on your thumb. That's the compression stroke. TDC is at the top of this stroke. 5. Screw in the spark plug with plastic tubing attached and insert the other end of the tube into a jar of light oil. Continue rotating the engine. Bubbles will appear until the piston reaches the top of its travel. When it starts down on the next stroke, the bubbles will stop and oil will begin traveling up the tube. Stop at a convenient point and mark the tube. Then mark the crank pulley and the engine body at a convenient spot. 6. Rotate the engine backwards and watch the oil recede into the jar. Continue rotating. As the piston continues past TDC and downward it will again suck oil into the tube. Rotate the engine till the oil again reaches the mark. STOP! Mark the crankshaft pulley where it lines up with the mark you made previously on the engine. You should now have two marks on the crankshaft pulley. The midpoint of these two marks lined up with the mark on the engine is TDC. Tom
56MarkII	-- 08-20-2020 @ 9:39 AM
	Lawrie and Tom0 I had the same opinion and even though messy filling the cylinder to the spark plug hole and carefully watching it rise and fall would most certainly work. The bump method is also a method I was forced to use in my trade as a mechanic because not all engines have timing marks and Deutz is a perfect example!! There were times a dial indicator was used through the injector bore or by using the valves like the cable tie mentioned by Lawrie. The engine would have to be turned to approximate TDC and the valves excessively set too tight to protrude enough to touch Piston. Then the engine would be rotated very carefully until the Piston touched the valve and then rotated the other way, both times making a mark using tape around the pulley or damper and accurately measuring the center point. The OD or circumference has to be measured and a simple formula used for proper spacing of the degree marks lol! In this case I would use a cable tie and gently rock back and forth and take the center point after all you won't have to worry about bending protruding valves. Just don't turn too hard on the bump or the cable tie could compress giving an inconsistent reading. Oil isn't even that bad of an idea either. A small vinyl hose could be used to syphone the oil out or keep in mind TDC is the beginning of your power stroke and when the Piston is BTC your exhaust valve will open and as you bring up the Piston to TDC the oil will be pushed out the exhaust. With this valve open you could even use an old shop vac pushed against the spark plug hole and suck it out this way as well, intake is closed exhaust is open. This is if you don't want the neighborhood filled with oil smoke.
krwilson5	-- 08-21-2020 @ 4:59 PM
	Thanks guys. I had not heard of the oil method. Sounds interesting and a bit messy, but probably does work. I didn't think that I could use the wire tie method with this engine after seeing nothing but valve through the spark plug hole, but I'll poke around and see. Since this engine hasn't run yet, I may just pull the head and use a dial indicate. Thanks again. Those are good suggestions.
TomO	-- 08-22-2020 @ 8:24 AM
	Read my reply carefully. You do NOT put oil in the cylinder, just the jar. When I used this method, I used vegetable oil and a small clear jar and used the top of the jar as my oil level mark. You can do the same thing with oil or water in a U shaped tube fastened to a board. The board is needed to keep the U shape constant through the procedure. Tom

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