| JayChicago | -- 03-14-2019 @ 3:40 PM |
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37 tudor. Car came to me with both quarter windows inoperable. I've determined that the regulators are correct and operating properly. I believe the problem is that on both windows, the bottom window channel, the piece that binds to the glass which the regulator's rollers slide in, have been replaced some time in the past but not located properly on the glass. This channel does not go the full width of the glass; when originally assembled they probably used a fixture or jig to locate it on the glass. There is only about a 1/2 inch adjustment in the regulator mounting, so this channel has to be on the glass in the correct location. So my question is, is there a drawing somewhere that tells exactly where along the bottom of the glass the channel should be located? Or any other idea on how I can locate them properly?
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| 1937sedandelivery | -- 03-14-2019 @ 8:09 PM |
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If you find any drawings, please let me know. Meantime, the attached pics are from my 37 Tudor driver's side window. They should help. If you need more, just let me know. Gregg I tried in vain to attach the pics. Not sure what is causing this. You can send me a message so I can send you the pics. gregg
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| 1937sedandelivery | -- 03-14-2019 @ 9:40 PM |
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alas, I re-started the webpage and it now allows me to attach files!
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| 1937sedandelivery | -- 03-14-2019 @ 9:41 PM |
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another pic
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| 1937sedandelivery | -- 03-14-2019 @ 9:42 PM |
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another pic
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| 1937sedandelivery | -- 03-14-2019 @ 9:42 PM |
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last pic
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| JayChicago | -- 03-15-2019 @ 9:09 PM |
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Gregg Thank you for taking the time to take those pictures for me. I appreciate it. But my problem is with the rear quarter windows, which have a different regulator and bottom glass channel. Do you think you would be able to get good pics like that of one of your rear windows? That would really help me. Thanks. Jay
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| 1937sedandelivery | -- 03-15-2019 @ 9:31 PM |
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Jay, oh, duh. I should have read your posting closer. Let me try to replicate the same for the rear quarters. It's my son's car and I don't recall if those windows are there. More tomorrow.... gregg
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| 1937sedandelivery | -- 03-16-2019 @ 2:01 PM |
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Boo, I failed you. One window is completely gone. I tried lowering the other window and it was stuck. After forcing it up and down just bit, the window came out of the channel. My guess is that it was in wrong. So, no pics or dimensions, sorry. If you do happen to find information on this, I would appreciate a copy. I won't be working on this car for at least another 6 months, at which time I will need to properly locate the glass in the channel. gregg
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| 3w2 | -- 03-16-2019 @ 2:13 PM |
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It's actually pretty straightforward. The channel at the bottom of the glass must clear the vertical runs throughout the travel of the window, up and down. If you measure from the inside of the runs, run to run, (several places to ensure a good consistent measurement) and subtract the depth of the runs you'll know where to locate the horizontal channel on the bottom of the glass.
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| 1937sedandelivery | -- 03-16-2019 @ 5:03 PM |
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Cool, that makes perfect sense (no wonder I didn't think of it). Thanks for the help! gregg
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| Don Rogers | -- 03-17-2019 @ 7:13 AM |
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Here's a picture of the channel. You previously indicated that you might not have originals.
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| JayChicago | -- 03-17-2019 @ 4:25 PM |
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Thanks all. But I don't think it is so simple on the rear quarter windows with the ventilator feature that slides the glass horizontally. It is not so simple as centering the bottom glass channel between the up-down glide channels. See picture attached, and note the big cam on the right regulator arm that engages a pin on the bottom glass channel to move the window horizontally.
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| JayChicago | -- 03-17-2019 @ 4:27 PM |
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Here is another picture as the window goes down and that big cam rotates away from the pin in the bottom glass channel.
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| JayChicago | -- 03-17-2019 @ 4:38 PM |
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I believe (right now at least) that my problem is the bottom glass channel is not at the right location on the glass. As I crank the regulator the glass moves forward and jambs against the window frame before the regulator and that big cam is in a position to lower the glass. Here is a pic of the bottom glass channel with the regulator out of the picture. I am hopeful someone with a 37 tudor can check the dimension in question. That will locate the bottom channel on the glass. Thanks Sorry picture got rotated when attached here. Don't know why that happened, don't know how to edit a picture once attached here. This message was edited by JayChicago on 3-17-19 @ 4:43 PM
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| 3w2 | -- 03-18-2019 @ 5:02 AM |
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The principle is the same regardless of it being a sliding vent window. The metal channel has to clear the side runs in any and all positions of the glass, up, down, and sideways.
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| TomO | -- 03-18-2019 @ 6:20 AM |
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Jay, Dave (3w2) is correct. Your channel is too close to the back of the glass, so it cannot move forward enough to engage the cam. If you have it too far forward, it would engage the cam before it is closed. I would center the channel on the glass. Tom
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| JayChicago | -- 03-18-2019 @ 6:24 AM |
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Yes, of course it has to be clear of the side run channels front and back. But there is more to it than just that. It also has to be located on the glass so the cam will function properly.
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| 3w2 | -- 03-18-2019 @ 6:37 PM |
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One last try; think about the lipped rubber insert in the metal channel that the glass nests into and what its secondary purpose is besides holding glass firmly in the channel. There is only one position on the glass that secondary purpose (keeping most of the water out) can be served as it does not extend out beyond the ends of the metal channel.
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| JayChicago | -- 03-18-2019 @ 10:20 PM |
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I don't doubt that centering the channel on the glass would work if I had an original glass channel. From the picture Don Rogers posted I see that the original was the full width of the glass, less 9/16 inch front and rear to clear the up-down run channels. But both of the glass channels I am working with are considerably shorter, and the two of them are not the same. The after market glass channel available today is listed as fitting years 34-40. I am thinking that one aftermarket piece can be made to work on all those years because the over-all length of the channel is not critical. But I believe the location of the pin that engages the cam is critical.
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| TomO | -- 03-19-2019 @ 7:48 AM |
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Jay, You may have answered your own question. The original channel is 32 7/16" long. You said in your previous post that when it is centered on the glass, there would be 9/16" to the end of the glass on both ends. That would make the glass 33 9/16" long at the bottom edge. If you place your shorter channel on the glass so that the channel is 9/16" from the front edge of the glass, it should work. From you photo, it looks like the channel is about 2 1/2" - 3" back from the front of the glass. If it doesn't, try this: Use a couple of short pieces of setting tape to hold the channel to te glass but are short enough to allow the glass to move in the channel. Put the channel on the glass near where you think it should work. Then install the glass in the car. If the problem is still the same, (the glass moves forward and jams against the frame) move the channel to the front of the glass about 1/16" and repeat. If the problem changed, move the channel back on the glass. I used a rubber hammer to move the glass in my coupe when I had the short pieces of tape holding the glass. Tom
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| JayChicago | -- 03-19-2019 @ 10:02 PM |
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Tom Yes, I agree, I think that is the right procedure. Thanks. Now I have to work up the courage to attempt removing the channels without breaking the glass. Both appear to be the original glass, in good condition with minimal delamination. I think I will take them to a near-by glass shop that has done restoration work, see if one of their old-timers is not afraid of it.
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| TomO | -- 03-20-2019 @ 9:15 AM |
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Jay, I use a piece of 1"x 2" wood seated against one end of the channel and then tap on the wood until the end of the channel is free from the glass. Then I used a 3/8" dowel to work the rest of the channel off of the glass. Tom
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| JayChicago | -- 03-27-2019 @ 4:23 PM |
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Follow-up: Windows are in the car, going up-down and fore-aft as they were meant to do. Thanks to all for your help. I had to relocate the lower glass channels on the glass as outlined above by TomO. Went to a local glass shop for the R&R on the glass channels. Must have been a piece-of-pie for a pro who has done it before, only charged $35. Well worth it, spared me the anxiety of breaking the glass. Anyone buying the aftermarket lower glass channels that are listed as fitting a multitude of years should know they will not necessarily work out of the box, probably will have to be cut down. To do that you will need at least one original channel to match, or a dimensioned drawing of an original as I got here from Don Rogers. Going to give a plug for Regulator Roy, who advertises every month in the V8 times: He had a part I needed that I could not find with the usual vendors. And he is a genuinely nice guy, enthusiastically spent time on the phone with me to help me sort out my problem.
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