| village grande | -- 03-02-2017 @ 11:00 AM |
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I'm looking to switch from bias to radial tires on my 51 stock ford Victoria. The tires on the car now are G 78/15 bias which convert to a 215/75 R15 in a radial. This is one size bigger than the cars original 6.70 /15 or 205/75 R15 but the G 78/15 seems to fit fine. Diamond Back has a model D-2 rated at 65,000 miles for $234 and a relatively new model D-1 rated at 40,000 miles for $179. The D-1 appears to be replacing their model M-5 as a lower cost alternative. Estimating my mileage at a couple thousand a year I'm leaning towards the D-1. My only concern is this tire has only been available for a year or so. It is not in the catalog yet. The D-2 is made in Japan and the D-1 in Korea, if this matters. If anyone has advice or had experience with Diamond Back or these tires your comments would be appreciated. Bill
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| carcrazy | -- 03-02-2017 @ 2:53 PM |
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While I don't have any experience with Diamond Back tires, I would like to share my experience with you in driving long distances on "show car tires" vs. driving on "modern car tires". If you can be happy with blackwall tires, I wholeheartedly recommend the use of modern radial ply tires. The modern tires will go the distance with minimal problems. My previous experience with "show car tires" from brand X was not so good, I experienced two flats within the first three years of ownership. I now have a set of Goodyear Assurance All-Season 205/75R15 Blackwall tires on a 1953 Ford with which I have been very happy - no tire problems in over 7,000 miles, many at highway speeds. Unfortunately, Goodyear no longer offers that tire. If you must have that size, Tire Rack offers a Kumho Solus TA11 Standard Touring Blackwall 205/75R15 for $65.37. If you are willing to go to a slightly smaller diameter tire, the same vendor also offers a General Altimax RT43 (T-speed rated) P205/70R15 Blackwall for $67.54. In addition to those prices you will have to add shipping and installation costs at a tire shop near you. This message was edited by carcrazy on 3-2-17 @ 2:55 PM
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| village grande | -- 03-02-2017 @ 4:59 PM |
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I'm assuming these are "modern radial tires" and are expensive because of supply and demand and the limited market for the wide white look. I guess the manufactures have us by the u know what's because some classic cars just don't look right without them.
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| len47merc | -- 03-02-2017 @ 7:04 PM |
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carcrazy - I have to both agree with you and disagree with you, or perhaps agree and 'add a different perspective' may be better wording. In agreeing with you, as crazy as it sounds, and some of you may recall this, it took 7 - yes SEVEN - sets of 3 1/4" bias ply Firestones, all sent/replaced at the supplier's expense, before I was able to obtain a set that would balance with less than 3 ounces total weight per tire, were minimally acceptable from a 'roundness' perspective, would road force test acceptably and would ride smooth up to 70 mph. I say 70 because the '47 is only driven 60 mph max but I ensured the final set would ride smooth up to 70 to ensure I was not always bumping-up against a vibration at 60. So why would anyone want to put themselves through this to obtain a 'marginal' show tire? The exercise to get a good set was beyond frustrating; however (and here's the different perspective), I have driven this set ~8,000 miles now including the ~1,000 mile round trip to Gettysburg last year and (knock on wood) not one issue thus far and you can barely tell the tires are worn. The car handles like it was designed to, I drive it the way it was designed to be driven and I love every bit of this aspect. And given the car is driven the way it was designed I plan accordingly and never feel pressured to drive faster/get where I'm going sooner and as a result, see more along the way each journey and meet more interesting people along the way. And I love the look of the bias ply on the '47. Aaannndd (here's a most important part) after taking a leisurely 12+ hours drive to Gettysburg one way my wife, when getting out of the car at the Wyndham, looked back at me before closing the door and walking away with the porter, and said she '...wasn't even tired...' and felt better after 12 'relaxing' hours in the Merc than a 3-hour sometimes tense 70-80 mph drive to Charleston from Raleigh in the Toyota Avalon. Freaking priceless! It comes down to what's important to you, how you plan on driving the car and what your overall expectations are. I know there are bias ply 'look' radials out there with the pie crust that will mitigate or completely eliminate the extraordinary effort I went through and will give you most of the look, but $$$'s. In the end I learned way more than I expected or wanted, but I've never regretted putting the bias plys on and plan on enjoying their look and feel for many more thousand miles. I chalk some of my wife's and my own enjoyment of the car up to the tires for these reasons. My response was to carcrazy but the content is definitely intended to help village grande with his original question. Steve
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| village grande | -- 03-03-2017 @ 7:53 AM |
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I've had the car for 3 years with the G 78 15 bias tires. The tread is still good and shows no sign of the front end being out of line. Front end was aligned and all front end components have been inspected and worn parts replaced. The car handles fine on a flat surface but will definitely have a mind of it's own if the road surface has ruts, cracks or is uneven. I'm told by fellow car owners that radials will make a big difference in handling. If this is true I would switch for the added safety and give up the original look I have now.
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| len47merc | -- 03-03-2017 @ 8:00 AM |
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10-4. Wasn't lobbying in any way, just adding some consideration. The radials will make a huge difference in handling without a doubt. I've just grown accustomed to and somehow learned to embrace the bias ply personality traits and it's become second nature to me now. I forgot to mention earlier that IMHO and 'eye' radials inherently give these EFV8's a more 'hot rod' look. If maximum drive-ability is what you are after you are absolutely on the right track for sure. Steve
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| TomO | -- 03-03-2017 @ 8:30 AM |
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Other than looks, my main objection to radial tires on an antique car has been price. There is also the faster degeneration of the tire. Radials cost more than bias ply tires from the usual suppliers and should be replaced after 7 years. The rubber and other supporting plys can be ready to fail, without showing any age cracks or other signs of deterioration. I would have to replace them with very little tread wear. The bias ply tires can last longer and it is very obvious when they are getting too old to drive on. They show age cracks, checking in the sidewall and cracks in the tread area, long before they are going to fail. I have not had the balance problem that Steve had and the only flat tire that I have had in the past 40 years of driving antique cars, was a tube defect that could have happened with radial tires. The price problem seems to have been solved by Calli Tire. They modify radial tires to install white walls on them, just like Diamondback, and have most tire sizes available. I do not know if their process damages the tire or if you must take special care of them. I am just passing on information from a friend who installed them for the first time on his late model Lincoln 2 years ago. http://www.callitw.com/ If you wish to have full wheel covers, you should buy new wheels as the full wheel covers will not stay on your stock wheels with radial tires. Buy radial tires with the highest traction rating that you can find. As the rubber ages, it gets harder and you lose traction. Starting out with a softer tire will give you better traction for the life of the tire. Tom
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| 42merc | -- 03-03-2017 @ 3:56 PM |
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I own a '42 Mercury station wagon, it's like driving a billboard down the road. At speed on any kind of road with Coker Firestone tires it requires two hands on the steering wheel to herd it down the road. The Coker tires are for the V8 meets. I also have a set wheels with radial tires mounted for real driving. With the radials, any road, any speed, driving is a joy and it can be done with one hand. There is no comparison.
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| blarge | -- 03-03-2017 @ 5:54 PM |
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42 Merc Did you have to replace the original 42 Mercury wheels to use the radial tires? I have been told the radials flex the rims and they may crack. Bill Large
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| len47merc | -- 03-04-2017 @ 4:46 AM |
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It really is a cr*p shoot on the Firestones if you wish to more than occasionally drive at 55-60 mph. They are more than unwieldy above 60 though the car isn't designed for that speed anyway. I have driven a stock with overdrive '40 with radials at 75+ and have to admit it was quite a comfortable drive. Once the bias plys are 'right' though, driving with only the left arm on the arm rest or window garnish and left hand on the wheel/thumb & 2 fingers and right arm on the chair back has been very comfortable up to 60, on this '47 anyway. Getting them 'right' is the trick and IMHO and experience tire-to-tire consistency cannot be expected and will likely not be realized on the Firestones, hence another reason to gravitate toward radials for some. During my original exercise in purchasing the Firestones, Coker, who acknowledged all the problems and responsibly and impressively stood behind their product, stopped just under a hair short of openly stating they do not recommend the Firestones or any currently available bias plys for anything other than shows or around town driving at most. They offered at one time to upgrade me at no cost to the bias-look radial offering they had at the time. In the end they worked with me to get a quality set and it was understood others at that time period that wished to use these bias plys for more than just shows or around town driving were having similar issues. Whether that has ever been corrected I am unaware. I look forward to reading the reply to Bill Large's question. Steve
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| 42merc | -- 03-04-2017 @ 3:29 PM |
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For the radial tires on my old Ford products I use original 15" x 5" '42-'48 Mercury or 15" x 5" F100 pickup wheels. ('53-'62). 15" x 5-1/2" wide F100 wheels were also available. I've not had a problem with any of the old OEM wheels. This of course hinges on selecting good wheels to start with. Rust, egged bolt holes, ect. We are talking many years of doing this. Real '42-'48 Merc wheels are scarce, F100 wheels not so much. To recognize the difference, look at the web between the bolt holes, early Merc will be stamped FORD, F100 will be stamped FO MO CO. They do look alike. I also own & drive a modified '40 coupe equipped with F100 wheels & radial tires, drives & handles like radial tires should. As stated above, radial tire life should not be pushed much past 7 years. They do make a big boom when the tread separates and kills a fender. The boom does not happen in the driveway, it happens at speed. First hand experience on the freeway in a '33 Ford roadster with 10 year old radial tires. Don
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| 1934 Ford | -- 03-06-2017 @ 7:13 AM |
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I have used Diamondback wide white radials on our 1935 Buick for 18 years. I love them. They are easy to clean and ride like a modern car. I'm close to ordering my fourth set. On the other hand I run the horrible old bias ply Firestones in the 34 Fords. Reason is longevity. Bias plys last almost forever compared to radials, measured in time. Bias ply's are worn out in 12-15,000 miles and are harder to balance, but in time, that last longer than radials. Radials on my cars never wear out, they just expire when the cords separate. I had one blow out in the garage too. Looked new tread wise but internal cord separation caused me to buy 4 new ones. My un-restored 35 Ford Pickup has Allstate bias ply truck tires that are now about 47 years old, but it only goes about 200 miles a year at less than 35-40 MPH. They are so hard that I doubt they would go flat if I let all the air out. Now I'm looking for radial wide whites for my 66 VW. Even though in 66 they came with 1" whitewalls, I like the 2 1/2" style and radials make the old VW into a sports car. i'll call Diamondback for them too. My advice: For show cars, buy bias ply. For drivers, buy Diamondback. I've seen lots of old show queens with 20 year old tires and wonder if the owner ever had any driving fun with those cars. 1934 Ford's since 1972
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