| len47merc | -- 03-19-2014 @ 5:53 PM |
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Need to remove the trans cover on a '47 Merc to remove the top trans-to-engine bolts. The original '47 front floor mat (see pic) is still in reasonable condition excepting for the aged brittleness - look at it wrong and it cracks so I know this exercise will do it in completely. Strongly prefer to come back with an original style mat with the driver and passenger carpet sections molded into the mat but have been unable to locate a source - only standard solid rubber Ford mats have been found to date. Any and all references appreciated. Steve This message was edited by len47merc on 3-19-14 @ 5:54 PM
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| blarge | -- 03-19-2014 @ 6:07 PM |
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Steve: Try every trick in the book to remove the bolts from the underside and preserve your original floor mat. If you can find a repo mat with the area where the carpet goes that is molded with an outline edge, you can sew the new carpet piece that most matches your original from the underside of the mat, then cut out the rubber and expose the carpet. This is as close as I know how to get an original look. I have never seen a replacement mat with the carpet in place. Bill Large
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| len47merc | -- 03-19-2014 @ 6:58 PM |
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Thanks Bill - in considering the showing and judging of this car in the Rouge class your recommendation in trying every trick in the book (trans bolts) to preserve the original makes total sense - that is the route I will take. The original insulation/matting underneath is in very good-to-excellent condition though it is somewhat adhered to the floor pan in places and is likely going to be a brittle bear as well. The brittleness of the mat is a given as even with my best efforts it still unfortunately cracked it in a few spots on the driver's side when necessarily rebuilding/replacing the entire brake system including the gunked-up and internally rusted master cylinder. If and when it is ever removed it will disintegrate or at minimum come out in chunks it is that delicate. A Mercury specific repo with or without a margined area for the carpet has not been located yet and any suggestions on this from anyone are appreciated. Great suggestion Bill on recreating the original design if a good repo can be sourced. Steve
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| TomO | -- 03-20-2014 @ 7:54 AM |
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Steve, I have never seen a Mercury specific front floor mat for any year Mercury. Bill Large spent a lot of time and energy restoring his Sportsman and if he could not find a mat, I doubt that there are any left. I agree with Bill Large that you should leave the mat in place and use long extensions and universal joints to remove the top bolts or leave the engine in the car and do your detailing with it in place. If you intend on using the extensions, lower the engine onto the frame to give you more clearance. Tom
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| 42merc | -- 03-20-2014 @ 10:13 AM |
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Long 3/8" drive extensions with a 9/16" "u" joint will access the upper bolts without a problem. It helps to remove the motor mount cushions & rest the water pumps on the cross member.
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| len47merc | -- 03-20-2014 @ 4:55 PM |
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Perfect - thanks. Have secured a loaner flathead motor stand so have decided to go ahead and pull the motor and install the main seals the 'easy' way. Plus will make mains, oil pump, timing cover, oil pan & starter installations much easier. Greatly appreciate 42merc's tip on 'every means possible' process to remove these trans-to-block bolts requiring cirque du soleil body contortions to remove from below. Leaving the floor mat alone. Agree with you Tom on your Bill Large reference. Perhaps luck will shine on me one day here and I can help us all for our model years. Steve This message was edited by len47merc on 3-20-14 @ 4:57 PM
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| blarge | -- 03-21-2014 @ 5:26 PM |
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Steve: The front mat used in the Mercury cars is different than the one used in a Ford. The cut out for the steering column is up higher because the angle on the steering column is different on the longer wheel base Mercury's. I have never seen a NOS mat for a Mercury. Bill Large
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| len47merc | -- 03-23-2014 @ 4:58 AM |
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Thanks Bill. UPDATE - the motor is now out without touching the floor mat/transmission cover. After resting the water pumps on the frame (mounts removed) to lower the engine/trans, the 2 passenger-side transmission-to-block bolts removed easily with a 9/16" closed/open end wrench and a bit of umphh to break them free. Same for bottom driver's side bolt - 3/8" drive 9/16" sockets/extensions/u-joints as recommended by 42merc expedited the removal of these 3 bolts. The top driver's side required removal of the shifter linkage (for access), body contortions to break it free (little-to-no room on this one bolt to use a socket/extensions/universals), shifting of the motor & trans toward the passenger side, 1/8 turn bites with the 9/16" closed end and the patience of Job to extract the last top driver's-side bolt. Thanks again to all for your great inputs. Steve
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| 42merc | -- 03-23-2014 @ 7:45 AM |
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When I said 9/16" universal, I should have said 9/16" flex socket, meaning not a 9/16" socket plus a universal joint. Much more compact. On reassembly insert the top two bolts in the trans housing before dropping the engine back in, they'll stay in place on their own.saves a little fussing later. Every little bit helps.
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| len47merc | -- 03-23-2014 @ 8:46 AM |
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Thanks 42merc - that cleared up some confusion on my part regarding your earlier reference and the very limited space I had on the top driver's side bolt. The first 3 bolts were very easy to remove with the closed end 9/16" and then by hand with the extension(s)/u-joint (not flex)/socket combo. The top driver's side was a bear though and after removing the shifter linkage in tight quarters I stubbornly and bull-headedly finished that bolt with the same wrench. Will definitely take your advice on the flex socket (purchase) and reassembly pre-install of the bolts - thanks again. Steve This message was edited by len47merc on 3-23-14 @ 8:48 AM
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| len47merc | -- 04-03-2014 @ 4:31 PM |
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Now that the motor is out (thanks to all for the great advice) why not (right?) go ahead and pull the transmission to clean it as well as change the original seeping/leaking front, rear (primary leak) and side cover selector (shift arms) gaskets and seals, plus a new release bearing & u-joint. The only problem - the same one - is preservation of the original and now very brittle Mercury specific front floor mat. Any experience out there with (efficiently) pulling the trans without removing the entire front floor pan is appreciated. Intuitively it looks to be possible but quite tedious (drop radius rod and mouting bracket for same, very limited/tight access to trans and u-joint 'cup' nuts/bolts, etc.). Am leaning toward changing the front and side cover selector seals and the release bearing only and dealing with the rear leak and likely-to-be somewhat worn splines of the original u-joint. With the motor out I hate not to take advantage of the opportunity to (efficiently) address these items as well. Steve
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| ford38v8 | -- 04-03-2014 @ 5:06 PM |
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Steve, the Rouge Class on the Ford V8 Club Concourse is intended to encourage the preservation of original examples of the Ford products. Any replacement or rebuilding of major elements of the car will result in detracting from that goal, reflected by the possible passing over of that area of the car for purposes of the Rouge Award. That said, to answer your question regarding transmission removal, it normally comes out the top, with floorboards removed. I imagine it would also come out by moving it forward while the engine is out, but can't be positive on that. Alan
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| len47merc | -- 04-03-2014 @ 5:59 PM |
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Thanks Alan - at this point my plan is to forgo the chassis/engine element and focus on the body & completely original interior, hence the need to preserve the front floor mat. The engine came out to change the front and rear seals. Prior to its removal the oil pan and timing cover were removed, cleaned, primed and painted (the correct colors) in my then ignorance/misinterpretation of Rouge class intent. Though I was advised to purchase a used, roached-out timing cover and pan and install them for judging, while continuing the in-car attempt at replacement of the rear seal the oil pump was pulled to facilitate access to the top rope seal carrier and chunks of caked-up non-detergent oil, likely compounded by the decades of idled time without running, came out with it. A concern was that some of the debris may have fallen into the oil channel for the mains which a look with a small dental mirror and flashlight confirmed. Ouch. Thus the now 38K original mile motor that I have put 1,500 miles of joyous drive time since bringing it back to life this past November had to be pulled. On top of this, while cleaning the years of gunk off of the motor which completely obscured the original Mercury blue color it was found the driver's side head was not original in design or color which became a huge problem for Rouge class according to efv8 technical advisers. Should I have chosen only to source and install another original 59 A-B head it would not have had the same patina as the balance of the motor and would have stood out (again, this from efv8 tech advisers), so I am basically out of luck now on this element of the Rouge class. Best laid plans the moral of the story here. Fundamentally this is now why I am now so focused on preserving the original front floor mat and finding a way to remove the trans without disturbing the trans cover and mat. Apologies for the dissertation - lessons learned here may help others. Cheers Steve
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| ford38v8 | -- 04-03-2014 @ 8:36 PM |
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Steve, All is not lost in your quest for a Rouge award. You are now aware, I'm sure, that there are three separate areas of Rouge Judging for which the award may be given without reference to the other areas that may not qualify. Your car may now qualify for Interior, and perhaps Exterior? The mismatch head having disqualified Engine/Chassis can now prove to be a benefit in your pleasure in driving your original Mercury, something that must be emphasized as why most of us are here in the first place! Alan
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